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Excited and Optimistic


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#1 Wings_Dynasty

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:42 AM

First off, let me say that Nick Lidstrom is one of my top 5 favorite Wings of all-time and in my opinion the best defensive defenseman of all-time.

Now, his (expected) retirement is a major chapter in the history of this team. I for one cannot remember any second in the last 20 years as a Wings fan where I thought that Nick Lidstrom was a liability. On the contrary, I felt that a 50% Nick Lidstrom was an upgrade over pretty much any other defenseman that the Wings could have put on the ice to replace him.

Now we as Wings fans finally get to see what we have consciously dreaded but somewhere deep in our collective subconsciousness have always wondered. "What will the Wings look like without #5?"

I am (as the thread title bears) excitedly optimistic, and here are some reasons why:

1. We are already a good team - had this happened in a year where we didn't already have a strong core of players (say 2000) I would be pulling my hair out. But we have a Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Kronwall, and even White to fall back on as a solid core of defensive players to build around. Not to mention the great 2-way forwards we have developing (Flip and Helm) and the ones in the minors.

2. We have SO much money - We just gained $6 million more chips in the Parise/Suter/Semin games. I would much rather have had only $3mil more (with the 1 year extension of Lids) but we have to look at what we have. I don't know the exact numbers, but if we drop the players to FA that I think we are going to drop (Stuart and Hudler) then there is even more money. I think we are looking at a summer where we sign 2 big FAs and a couple role players.

3. We are deep - Half of the Griffins played last season, and I wasn't really put off by any of them. In fact, a couple I would have wanted to take a roster spot from some vets that were having off seasons or were playing for less than they were being paid (Cleary, Hudler, Franzen). Smith, Tatar, Nyquist, and Mursak all looked good in the short time I got to see them and I think at least 2 GRGs will have roster spots on the big club this season.

and finally...

4. What else could you ask for? - I mean, come on, he has left a HUGE impact on the current roster and his presence will be felt for years. Other than retiring after winning a Cup (which probably wouldn't be likely since he would probably feel that he still had something in the tank) or winning another Norris, what else can he really do to excel? I don't blame him for calling it a career, maybe he will stay with the Wings as a European scout or a director of something, or, I daren't say it aloud, decide to take an upper management position that was said to be vacated when he retired...

Anyways, good luck Nick and thanks for being the wall in front of the goalie.

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#2 ShanahanMan

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 07:56 AM

We do NOT already have a good team, otherwise we wouldn't have had our asses handed to us in the first round. Datsyuk and Zetterberg have nothing to do with the absence Lidstrom will leave on the blueline and Kronwall, while a solid player, is no where near Lidstrom level and, in my opinion, never will be.

We are NOT that deep, as most farm boys who we've been giving shots to have really been disappointing thus far. Kindl, Emmerton, Mursak to name a few. You think these guys are the future? Sure, there's potential in Nyquist and Smith but it's way too early to tell and I see 3rd line at best. I mean, Babcock himself commented on his brilliantly after we got eliminated, basically saying we were putting 3rd and 4th line guys on our 1st and 2nd. I mean, Abdelkader a 2nd line center? Give me a break.

We may seem like we have a lot of money, but considering the scarcity of the FA market this summer, expect the star players to command big big bucks. And we know how Holland feels about "spending". Well, other than bloated 10 year+ contracts that is.

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).



Seriously though, how does the sand taste?

Edited by ShanahanMan, 31 May 2012 - 08:00 AM.



I HATE JASON WILLIAMS

#3 KrazyGangsta

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:03 AM

Lidstrom retired not because the team is lacking to go after FA's but because he has accomplished everything and wants to keep his body in good condition. He doesn't want to be forced to retirement like Rafalski had to. If I'm Lids place I would do same thing, I have my Stanley Cups, my gold medal, norris's etc... I just retire with a perfect health. As for FA I think we will be pursuing Parise & Suter.

Ken Holland is one of the most aggressive spenders if you guys forgotten prior to the lockout. His a smart manager, you just can't spend big bucks every year in a cap era. The team needs to be built from the core with our own talent. You can't afford to go sign players (take the chance of under performing and having the issue of losing your own talent due to being tight on salary cap. All tho in cases like now that we have a lot of money you got to go plug the holes which he will do.

#4 rick zombo

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:05 AM

We do NOT already have a good team, otherwise we wouldn't have had our asses handed to us in the first round. Datsyuk and Zetterberg have nothing to do with the absence Lidstrom will leave on the blueline and Kronwall, while a solid player, is no where near Lidstrom level and, in my opinion, never will be.

We are NOT that deep, as most farm boys who we've been giving shots to have really been disappointing thus far. Kindl, Emmerton, Mursak to name a few. You think these guys are the future? Sure, there's potential in Nyquist and Smith but it's way too early to tell .

We may seem like we have a lot of money, but considering the scarcity of the FA market this summer, expect the players to command big big bucks. And we know how Holland feels about "spending". Well, other than bloated 10 year+ contracts that is.

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).

Seriously though, how does the sand taste?


No offence, but I think this is just selfish fan talk.

I think if you asked Nick he would prefer if Holland looked after the future of the Wings franchise rather than mortgage it to give him, as an individual, one more shot at the cup. But maybe you feel differently.

Edited by rick zombo, 31 May 2012 - 08:06 AM.

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#5 ShanahanMan

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:10 AM

No offence, but I think this is just selfish fan talk.

I think if you asked Nick he would prefer if Holland looked after the future of the Wings franchise rather than mortgage it to give him, as an individual, one more shot at the cup. But maybe you feel differently.



Sorry, that quote was referring to last year.


I HATE JASON WILLIAMS

#6 xtrememachine1

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:20 AM

I don't mean to minimize the loss of Nick Lidstrom, arguably the greatest Red Wing of all time. His loss will be felt in our lineup and in our hearts. However, losing Lidstrom doesn't mean the Wings are going to be a crap team now. We have a ton of cap space and a smart front office. We'll never replace Nick Lidstrom, but that won't stop them from trying fill that void. Plus, it should be mentioned that there are 29 other teams out there that didn't have Nick Lidstrom this year and two of them are playing for the Stanley Cup right now. The last 4 Stanley Cup champions, won without Nick Lidstrom. We can too. Will it be harder? Of course. Is it impossible? Not even close. We still have Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Franzen, Howard, Kronwall and whomever we sign with the insane amount of cap space we now have.

Being sad about Lidstrom retiring is one thing. It hurts, its going to hurt. He's been around for 20 years and is connected with pretty much all of the success we've enjoyed during that time. But don't be upset or worry about the state of the team because of him leaving. We'll continue to be competitive with the elite talent we still have.

#7 Diluvian04

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:26 AM

Well, to look at the positives. We have the money to get both Parise and Suter. A chance to let some of the kids come up and play, We don't have a rule to follow where players cannot make more than Lidstrom. I'm not happy about Lidstrom retiring but he isnt exactly the same guy in 2012 as opposed to say 2008. His experience on the ice will be missed but I would rather him retire now while we have money then later when our assets are maxed. I think Suter will make up the defensive side and Parise will help with the offensive side assuming we are able to get him. Without Lidstrom we are a borderline playoff team with Lidstrom
We are a cup contender. To think our team without Lidstrom and no additions is a bad team isn't fair to the rest of the players. Upgrades to a good portion of the team is better than a downgrade to one position.
I personally think IF we get some talented players July 1 then we will perfectly fine.

#8 pucktividi

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:36 AM

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).


Lack of motivation and drive to continue of doing 6/7 days workouts,being away from his family and his hometown.Those things wouldn't change even with Suter or Parise on the roster.

#9 Dimaline312000

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:48 AM

This was going to happen sooner or later and I for one am glad it happened sooner. Yes we will have to find a suitable replacement for him and that will not be easy at all and I hate to say it I'm losing my confidence in Kenny Holland as a GM to get players in here that can get us back to the Cup. It's better to happen now while he can leave on a semi-positve note that he didn't stay and become a liabilty to our team like we've seen in the past he's leaving knowing he game his best and did all the could to contirbute to the team. We will now have the space to go after some big-name UFA's that can provide a youth injection to our roster which I think is what we need. I still have faith that our newer younger players like Mursak, Emmerton, and Kindl as well as Smith and Nyquist will get better in the years to come given they get ample ice-time to improve their skills. Obviously I want the Wings to get back to the Cup ASAP but it may take a bit longer to gather a team with the right chemistry and nucleas to do so. This is a changing of the gaurds but it doesn't have to be a bad thing. I'm anxious to see what is to come.

#10 Frozen-Man

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 09:06 AM

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).


The words may be his but you ripped them out of his context and put them into yours, completely manipulating what he said.

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#11 Krayzie_Bone

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 09:16 AM

We do NOT already have a good team, otherwise we wouldn't have had our asses handed to us in the first round. Datsyuk and Zetterberg have nothing to do with the absence Lidstrom will leave on the blueline and Kronwall, while a solid player, is no where near Lidstrom level and, in my opinion, never will be.

We are NOT that deep, as most farm boys who we've been giving shots to have really been disappointing thus far. Kindl, Emmerton, Mursak to name a few. You think these guys are the future? Sure, there's potential in Nyquist and Smith but it's way too early to tell and I see 3rd line at best. I mean, Babcock himself commented on his brilliantly after we got eliminated, basically saying we were putting 3rd and 4th line guys on our 1st and 2nd. I mean, Abdelkader a 2nd line center? Give me a break.

We may seem like we have a lot of money, but considering the scarcity of the FA market this summer, expect the star players to command big big bucks. And we know how Holland feels about "spending". Well, other than bloated 10 year+ contracts that is.

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).



Seriously though, how does the sand taste?


LMAO the Red Wings do not have a good team? How many wins at home in a row? Making the playoffs means you at least have a good team. Sure its not a great team or anything but thats the way of the road.

#12 SouthernWingsFan

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 05:48 PM

We do NOT already have a good team, otherwise we wouldn't have had our asses handed to us in the first round. Datsyuk and Zetterberg have nothing to do with the absence Lidstrom will leave on the blueline and Kronwall, while a solid player, is no where near Lidstrom level and, in my opinion, never will be.

We are NOT that deep, as most farm boys who we've been giving shots to have really been disappointing thus far. Kindl, Emmerton, Mursak to name a few. You think these guys are the future? Sure, there's potential in Nyquist and Smith but it's way too early to tell and I see 3rd line at best. I mean, Babcock himself commented on his brilliantly after we got eliminated, basically saying we were putting 3rd and 4th line guys on our 1st and 2nd. I mean, Abdelkader a 2nd line center? Give me a break.

We may seem like we have a lot of money, but considering the scarcity of the FA market this summer, expect the star players to command big big bucks. And we know how Holland feels about "spending". Well, other than bloated 10 year+ contracts that is.

You know what we could have asked for? Our GM to give our star player and captain a better team to support him his final season. Otherwise, maybe he wouldn't "lack the motivation and drive to continue" (his words not mine).



Seriously though, how does the sand taste?

This team was moving along quite well for a division title or at worst a 4th seed, then injuries mounted up unfortuantely. While I wouldn't have objected to being aggressive at the trade deadline, getting one or two more players likely wouldn't have solved the depth issues due to injuries.

And nobody can prepare for the absurd amount of injuries the Wings had at the time, not the best GM in the world, not a little league coach, nobody.

And lack of motivation over a 20 year period just doesn't appear over the final season magically due to others getting injured. You do something for a lengthy amount of time, it is natural that you are going to think about trying something different after a while.

They have made the playoffs 21 years in a row. These days in the NHL, no matter how much we don't like it (and I don't either a lot), a good bit of times now it's just make it and anybody has a good shot at making a deep playoff run - regardless of seeding. You don't have to look no further than this season with the Finals being a 6/8 matchup, or 2006 when the Wings got upset in the 1st round, it was a 5/8 matchup in the Finals.

This team, while things will now be different, still has a solid core and plenty of money to get free agents this off season.

Edited by SouthernWingsFan, 31 May 2012 - 05:50 PM.


#13 GMRwings1983

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 06:37 PM

It'll be tough making the playoffs next season unless we have a huge offseason signing.

We finished 5th this season and the West is getting more and more competitive each year. Also, the Wings looked putrid when Lidstrom was injured late in the season.

It'll likely be a dogfight to get one of those last few spots. A Parise or Suter would make that easier of course.
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#14 Jericho613

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 08:33 PM

I Think this is a great thing for the Wings, he retired when the wings are able to go out and sign some good players, its gonna take 3 good players to replace him. If we get the coveted free agents we want, they will make up for losing Lidstrom.

#15 8 Legged RedWing

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 09:11 PM

We are NOT that deep, as most farm boys who we've been giving shots to have really been disappointing thus far. Kindl, Emmerton, Mursak to name a few. You think these guys are the future? Sure, there's potential in Nyquist and Smith but it's way too early to tell and I see 3rd line at best. I mean, Babcock himself commented on his brilliantly after we got eliminated, basically saying we were putting 3rd and 4th line guys on our 1st and 2nd. I mean, Abdelkader a 2nd line center? Give me a break.


Please tell me how those three, especially Mursak in his short stints have "really been disappointing." Are you expecting them to score on every shift? Mursak brings the same speed and energy we see from Helm. There is no way if Nyquist pans out to his full potential, that he is a 3rd liner at best. If he adds a little strength to his game, he would compliment the 1st or 2nd line great next year. Who cares we lost in the first round. It wasn't our year. That doesn't mean we automatically don't have a good team. Do Pitt and Van have terrible teams as well?

#16 MabusIncarnate

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 11:49 PM

I'm starting to get a bit sick of people ripping on this team and discrediting what we accomplished this past season because we got knocked out in the first round. WE STILL HAVE A GOOD TEAM. We finished the regular season OVER 100 points, again. We broke A RECORD for the most consecutive home wins, and yeah, the Preds got the better of us in the first round, and if you haven't learned by now that the NHL playoffs are wildly unpredictable then it might be time to move on to a different sport. We got knocked out, s*** happens. We won't win the championship every season. The Bruins, Canucks, and Penguins all fell in the first round this season, I don't tend to browse on other team's forums but are they all panicking and claiming the end of an era? Are they bad teams that are in desperate need of a rebuild or high value signings because they lost in the first round?

It's the core of this team that makes us competitive and a playoff team season after season. If we finished 5th seed and we are a bad team, then LA and NJ must be awful.

Oh and i'm sorry our 6th round pick Mursak isn't a superstar after 44 career games. :rolleyes:

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#17 Motown4013

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:28 PM

Remember when Filppula was "disappointing and "hadn't lived up to his potential". As Babcock said on more than one occasion this year, he was our most consistant forward all yhear long. Thats why it takes some guys a while....everyone at their own pace. Flip was awesome all year and then in the WC so lets PAUSE a moment if Mursak, who was really injured, needs more than 20 games to show us he is worthy.
We have a very good team, a great core of guys who lost in the 1st round to a talented and healthy and hungry team....with an amazing goalie.
Your post reeks of pubescent insecurity. We need a tweak or two which should be addressed in the offseason and we are a cup winning team.
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#18 Esquire

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:41 PM

We need a tweak or two which should be addressed in the offseason and we are a cup winning team.


I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree here.

Wings are losing 2 top line defenseman, they might lose Homer, and are desperate for a proven goal scorer. And those are just the improvements that even casual non-Wing fans can point out about this team.

Big changes are needed, and big changes are coming.
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#19 pucktividi

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:56 PM

I'm going to go ahead and strongly disagree here.

Wings are losing 2 top line defenseman, they might lose Homer, and are desperate for a proven goal scorer. And those are just the improvements that even casual non-Wing fans can point out about this team.

Big changes are needed, and big changes are coming.


Agree,we've lost 3 Cup winning d-men in 2 off-seasons(Lidstrom,Rafalski,Stuart).That said we need more than just some tweaks this time.

Edited by pucktividi, 01 June 2012 - 01:56 PM.


#20 hooon

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:59 PM

It'll be tough making the playoffs next season unless we have a huge offseason signing.

We finished 5th this season and the West is getting more and more competitive each year. Also, the Wings looked putrid when Lidstrom was injured late in the season.

It'll likely be a dogfight to get one of those last few spots. A Parise or Suter would make that easier of course.


The Wings looked putrid because they were also missing Datsyuk, Howard, MacDonald, Helm, Eaves, and Ericsson during that same stretch that Lidstrom was out.
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