TANK IT! 2014-2015 Season

[e_prime 1,936]

I like it because it's kind of a catch all for all the rampant stupidity that dorks like us can find to talk about. It's like a catch-all for absurdity lest if spill into other areas. You can't be off topic in a thread that had no meaningful topic to begin with.

...but can I be disappointed with it?

I guess, I could show my disappointment by giving this thread only 1-star.

...but I think I'll reserve judgement until it plays out furtherzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz (or a mod edits the Thread Title.)

Edited February 4, 2015 by e_prime

[BottleOfSmoke 5,965]

You don't get it. He's not judging them. He's "not expecting" them to do anything. You can't be in judgement of something through omission. Here, I'll show you.

Not expecting someone to be innocent is not the same thing as judging them guilty.

Not expecting a racoon attack is not the same thing as judging it unlikely.

Not expecting Michael Bay films to be good is not the same thing as judging they'll be bad.

Not expecting someone to say something meaningful is not the same a judging that their words are meaningless.

See. It's a way to be in possession of two conflicting points of view at the same time. Because you've committed to neither. The obvious benefit, of course, is that you can never be wrong.

Why go through all that to not be wrong? I just say "I'm right" even when I'm (never) wrong, and that's the end of that!

[kipwinger 8,521]

Why go through all that to not be wrong? I just say "I'm right" even when I'm (never) wrong, and that's the end of that!

Why do people do the things they do? I'd sooner try to reach out and touch the moon than understand Frankgrimes' thinking.

[TheXym 2,606]

Too much metaphysical postulating and not enough getting the wheels on the tank,

[number9 3,297]

Too much metaphysical postulating and not enough getting the wheels on the tank,

...Frank the tank?

[Wheelchairsuperhero 1,453]

edit: Been meaning to post a picture like this in this thread for a while.

Edited February 4, 2015 by Wheelchairsuperhero

[The Greek 323]

I imagine Don Cherry's god spitting on minorities and not winning the Stanley Cup.

This is literally the best post I've ever read.

In all seriousness, I love this thread. I also love how the metric for success seemed to change and eventually disappear. First, it was "we should tank the season, because this team is so terrible it won't even be exciting." Then it became, "we may be winning now, but it won't last." Then it became, "the season is a failure if we don't make it past X round in the playoffs." Now, the negative contingent has resorted to saying that everyone else thinks Holland is God. For the record, I know most of us have been critical of Kenny at some point, but one thing is clear: he is way better at his job than any of us are.

[TheXym 2,606]

Somebody needs to photoshop Kenny in the cupola of a tank. I'm thinking a WWII era Sherman or, if ya want to be completely ridiculous, a WWI tank.

(If you want to be way too obnoxious, put a turret on a short bus).

Edited February 4, 2015 by TheXym

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

When a problem comes along you must TANK it!

Tank it Good!

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

Sometimes I peruse threads instead of reading them fully, and then I finally come across something funny, or nice and I have to back track to see how it came to be.

#croptopit

#getthewheelsonthetank

[FlashyG 1,799]

Gotta hand it to this Leafs fan. His team may suck but he loves them anyways

[jimmyemeryhunter 2,747]

http://twopadstack.net/5-fringe-teams-win-stanley-cup/

Seen this on HF boards.

It made me laugh.

Chicago?!?

Boston??!

LA!?!?

This guys choices are wayyy too risky.

Edited February 5, 2015 by jimmyemeryhunter

[frankgrimes 1,836]

B

For the record, I know most of us have been critical of Kenny at some point, but one thing is clear: he is way better at his job than any of us are.

Every GM - including MacT, Snow and even Feaster - is better at being a GM than any of us fans are. There are only 30 GM jobs and it's extremely hard to get this job. Same thing goes for coaches, assistant GMs..So that's nothing new Holland did set the bar incredible high by getting the players we've missed and Sather and him were the most active GMs on trade dead lines and free agency if the team needed improvement(s) but for whatever reason his approach changed and he became much more inactive. The Avs just lost EJ for an extended period of time and they are lucky if they even make the playoffs at this point.. Lol at Boston, Los Angeles and Chicago being risky picks... Edited February 5, 2015 by frankgrimes

[Son of a Wing 1,644]

B

Every GM - including MacT, Snow and even Feaster - is better at being a GM than any of us fans are. There are only 30 GM jobs and it's extremely hard to get this job. Same thing goes for coaches, assistant GMs.. So that's nothing new Holland did set the bar incredible high by getting the players we've missed and Sather and him were the most active GMs on trade dead lines and free agency if the team needed improvement(s) but for whatever reason his approach changed and he became much more inactive. The Avs just lost EJ for an extended period of time and they are lucky if they even make the playoffs at this point.. Lol at Boston, Los Angeles and Chicago being risky picks...

Two words Frank: SALARY CAP

[derblaueClaus 1,668]

B

Every GM - including MacT, Snow and even Feaster - is better at being a GM than any of us fans are. There are only 30 GM jobs and it's extremely hard to get this job. Same thing goes for coaches, assistant GMs.. So that's nothing new Holland did set the bar incredible high by getting the players we've missed and Sather and him were the most active GMs on trade dead lines and free agency if the team needed improvement(s) but for whatever reason his approach changed and he became much more inactive. The Avs just lost EJ for an extended period of time and they are lucky if they even make the playoffs at this point.. Lol at Boston, Los Angeles and Chicago being risky picks...

The way how this season is going so far LA is a very risky pick. With 5 points out of a wildcard spot it's very likely they don't even make the playoffs. Boston isn't playing like a contender either......

'

Edited February 5, 2015 by derblaueClaus

[rick zombo 3,739]

Two words Frank: SALARY CAP

Nah bro. You're wrong. Holland's lost his drive. Plain and simple. He doesn't give a crap about winning anymore. Not like he used to. That's why he won't trade Larkin or Mantha or Tatar or Jurco or Nyquist. He doesn't have the drive to trade those guys he personally drafted for a rental. He's getting soft.

[Son of a Wing 1,644]

The way how this season is going so far LA is a very risky pick. With 5 points out of a wildcard spot it's very likely they don't even make the playoffs. Boston isn't playing like a contender either......

'

But they've got TRUCULENCE!

[wings4thecup06 504]

B

Every GM - including MacT, Snow and even Feaster - is better at being a GM than any of us fans are. There are only 30 GM jobs and it's extremely hard to get this job. Same thing goes for coaches, assistant GMs.. So that's nothing new Holland did set the bar incredible high by getting the players we've missed and Sather and him were the most active GMs on trade dead lines and free agency if the team needed improvement(s) but for whatever reason his approach changed and he became much more inactive. The Avs just lost EJ for an extended period of time and they are lucky if they even make the playoffs at this point.. Lol at Boston, Los Angeles and Chicago being risky picks...

I'm not about to go and make out the KH is a God or anything, and yes there have been moves I've disagreed with, but I think you have to give him a ton of credit for changing his philosophy.

Let's face it. The odds of winning the Cup are pretty slim. It's the reason why it's the hardest trophy (IMO) to obtain. How many teams have we seen in the Cap era who have traded away their future in the aim of building their team up only to falter and then slip into oblivion for a few years?

The Wings have at least, been consistently competitive since the lockout. Maybe not where everyone wants, but the fact still remains that you make the playoffs = you have a shot. Thus, it seems to me that KH and co realised that the way to maintain longterm security and a great team was to go this route we are currently seeing coming to fruition now. Build up and grow your prospects well enough, don't make trades or FA signings that will handcuff you, and add the right pieces only when the time is right.

[frankgrimes 1,836]

I'm not about to go and make out the KH is a God or anything, and yes there have been moves I've disagreed with, but I think you have to give him a ton of credit for changing his philosophy.

Let's face it. The odds of winning the Cup are pretty slim. It's the reason why it's the hardest trophy (IMO) to obtain. How many teams have we seen in the Cap era who have traded away their future in the aim of building their team up only to falter and then slip into oblivion for a few years?

The Wings have at least, been consistently competitive since the lockout. Maybe not where everyone wants, but the fact still remains that you make the playoffs = you have a shot. Thus, it seems to me that KH and co realised that the way to maintain longterm security and a great team was to go this route we are currently seeing coming to fruition now. Build up and grow your prospects well enough, don't make trades or FA signings that will handcuff you, and add the right pieces only when the time is right.

I give him and others a ton of credit. Yes, we as fans have the luxury to play armchair GMs and also the luxury of not knowing what goes on internally. That being said I think we all can agree that some moves just can leave someone head-scratching i.e re-signing some guys that shouldn't have been re-signed at least not for that amount of caphit or not buying out certain players. I fully agree with you I think Lord Stanley is bar the toughest trophy to win so many things have to go right and it's one heck of a grind by the time these guys reach the finals they might have played ~ 95 games.

The thing I don't like is how radically Holland changed his approach - again I know GMs should know what they are doing and are having their reasons - but going from one of the most active GMs in the game to someone who does almost nothing and just watches the by far best team in the league going to very good then "only" in the mix to not being considered serious contenders is odd to me (I get it we know have something called salary cap...) but there should be some middle ground between being the most active and one of the least active ? Wouldn't you agree.

Yes, this upcoming UFA pool is bad the biggest UFA will be a non player and we all know who that guy is but if the amount of talent Holland and the scouts (don't forget Hakan that guy is wow !) have gathered over the years is wgood Holalnd should be able to use some of them as assetts and get a top 4 defenseman.

[hockeybrianboy 6]

Wings shouldn't tank for the soul purpose that they have so much young talent on the NHL roster you NEED to give those guys the experience of competing for playoff seeds, even if they're a Dman away from being a real cup contender come playoff time. Yes the team is still a long shot until they get better at the back end but if you don't subject Nyquist, Tatar to those expectations and rigors every year you're never going to get to the cup where they're in their prime and they're ready to win a cup or two.

There's no such thing as NHL dynasties anymore due to the cap. No one's going to stay on top forever. Just have to ride the waves; they could be back on top when Nyquist and Tatar hit their prime years.

[TheXym 2,606]

Very true, you almost need to lose in the playoffs to learn how to win. Think back to how the Devils crushed the Wings in 1995 (I had tix for game 5 if it had happened), but that set the table in some ways for the 97 and 98 wins. I remember the victory lap with the Campbell trophy for winning the conference because it had been such a long drought. Even though on paper, the Wings should have won the Finals, that belied that mentally they weren't quite there yet, and the Scott Stevens destroying of Kozlov became a metaphor for the series.

The adding of Shanahan and the experience from '95 were key to the subsequent success. 2002 was a cup that should have been a no brainier, but if not for Lidstrom's long range score on Cloutier, they could have been gone in the first. So many things have to go right in a playoff run to get the cup. Cujo played great in goal for the Wings when he was here, but the boys gave him no run support, and Cujo was unfairly blamed for early exits by many.

Last year's stretch run to the playoffs was a step for the younger players, but they didn't know how to get it done in the post season, and Boston was a good team. That experience paid off this year - Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan are all playing at the high end of expectations for them, if not exceeding them. If our boys stay healthy, they have a chance in a seven game series against any team in the league his year. They may not be favorites, but I don't think they will get blown out by anyone if they are healthy.

Edited February 5, 2015 by TheXym

[TheXym 2,606]

Gotta hand it to this Leafs fan. His team may suck but he loves them anyways

There is another vid of that with game footage of the game seven loss, and lots of sad leaf fan pics, plus one of the best arena signs I've ever seen - "How do the Maple Leafs have a web site when they can't put 3 W's together?"

[frankgrimes 1,836]

Very true, you almost need to lose in the playoffs to learn how to win. Think back to how the Devils crushed the Wings in 1995 (I had tix for game 5 if it had happened), but that set the table in some ways for the 97 and 98 wins. I remember the victory lap with the Campbell trophy for winning the conference because it had been such a long drought. Even though on paper, the Wings should have won the Finals, that belied that mentally they weren't quite there yet, and the Scott Stevens destroying of Kozlov became a metaphor for the series.

The adding of Shanahan and the experience from '95 were key to the subsequent success. 2002 was a cup that should have been a no brainier, but if not for Lidstrom's long range score on Cloutier, they could have been gone in the first. So many things have to go right in a playoff run to get the cup. Cujo played great in goal for the Wings when he was here, but the boys gave him no run support, and Cujo was unfairly blamed for early exits by many.

Last year's stretch run to the playoffs was a step for the younger players, but they didn't know how to get it done in the post season, and Boston was a good team. That experience paid off this year - Nyquist, Tatar, Sheahan are all playing at the high end of expectations for them, if not exceeding them. If our boys stay healthy, they have a chance in a seven game series against any team in the league his year. They may not be favorites, but I don't think they will get blown out by anyone if they are healthy.

That's why it's by far the hardest trophy to win in all of sports the salary cap, revenue sharing and some **** CBA rules have made it even more difficult but I don't agree that you have to lose in order to learn how to win it all. Young players need confidence and experience but getting slauthered against Boston might not have been the best experience (if Detroit makes it they should use that as motivation if possible).

God that 2002 team how do I miss them may be one of the best rosters ever and what a great year that has been

[PavelValerievichDatsyuk 1,935]

The thing I don't like is how radically Holland changed his approach - again I know GMs should know what they are doing and are having their reasons - but going from one of the most active GMs in the game to someone who does almost nothing and just watches the by far best team in the league going to very good then "only" in the mix to not being considered serious contenders is odd to me (I get it we know have something called salary cap...) but there should be some middle ground between being the most active and one of the least active ? Wouldn't you agree.

Yes, this upcoming UFA pool is bad the biggest UFA will be a non player and we all know who that guy is but if the amount of talent Holland and the scouts (don't forget Hakan that guy is wow !) have gathered over the years is wgood Holalnd should be able to use some of them as assetts and get a top 4 defenseman.

As you pointed to, the league has changed dramatically with the salary cap and contract rules, and the situation of the team has changed - You've got to adapt to survive or get left behind. I look at the Devils as an example of a GM who didn't make the transition well. I think you're sentimental for something that isn't possible anymore and also isn't necessarily needed.

There looks like some good UFAs available to me: Franson, Greene, Boychuck, Erhoff, Staal, Martin, Oduya? Fleury, Zuccarello, Stewart. Williams? Spezza? Potentially a lot of Dmen, specifically.

Edited February 5, 2015 by PavelValerievichDatsyuk

[frankgrimes 1,836]

As you pointed to, the league has changed dramatically with the salary cap and contract rules, and the situation of the team has changed - You've got to adapt to survive or get left behind. I look at the Devils as an example of a GM who didn't make the transition well. I think you're sentimental for something that isn't possible anymore and also isn't necessarily needed.

There looks like some good UFAs available to me: Franson, Greene, Boychuck, Erhoff, Staal, Martin, Oduya? Fleury, Zuccarello, Stewart. Williams? Spezza? Potentially a lot of Dmen, specifically.

Maybe I'm a bit sentimental but I still believe their should be a middle ground.

Best UFAs will be: Franson, Boychuck, Ehrhoff and of course Staal

Spezza, Fleury re-signed during the season. Williams would be a nice gritty depth player