chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Anyone think Holland will sign or try hard to sign him July 1 ( if he doesn't sign with Vegas before that)? Seems like a very Kenny move to me. He needs a top pairing Dman, and all he needs to do is throw money at him. He'll want $7-8 million per, and long term I'm sure. Would take up all the free cap and then some, but he could move Nyquist or Tatar for high 2018 picks and bonus if Vegas takes a nice contract off his hands. Can be done. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 He will, and it will be a mistake that hurts the rebuild.Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk 2 Nightfall and chaps80 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Shattenkirk is going to get MASSIVELY overpaid and the last thing this team needs is another bad contract. In my opinion he is a very good 2nd pairing defenseman / power-play quarterback. He's not a legit top pair guy. No thanks! 2 kliq and marcaractac reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, DickieDunn said: He will, and it will be a mistake that hurts the rebuild. Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk Agreed. Maybe if he didn't sign Nielson it could work. Least Green is done after this coming season. 5 minutes ago, krsmith17 said: Shattenkirk is going to get MASSIVELY overpaid and the last thing this team needs is another bad contract. In my opinion he is a very good 2nd pairing defenseman / power-play quarterback. He's not a legit top pair guy. No thanks! Yeah he's def not worth $7 million and above for 5-6 years. Kenny will probably do it though. It's his perfect move. Easy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, chaps80 said: Agreed. Maybe if he didn't sign Nielson it could work. Least Green is done after this coming season. Yeah he's def not worth $7 million and above for 5-6 years. Kenny will probably do it though. It's his perfect move. Easy. I wouldn't bank on that. I hope we trade him for a 1st round pick at or before the deadline, but I wouldn't be at all shocked if we re-sign him before then. And honestly, I would much prefer have Green at a similar deal, 2-3 years at $5-6M, than Shattenkirk at 5-7 years at $7+M... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Shattenkirk rumors are he wants to play for the Rangers, with a small chance he might choose NJD if they're willing to pay him. This is like Suter. We're not getting him. 2 chaps80 and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 5,130 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Ya, with money not being our ace in the hole, there's no real way of attracting him. Despite all of our perfect scenarios, this is reality. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Juklitz 85 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 This is good reality. Somebody is going to overpaid him despite the fact he was nearly like third pairing guy for Blues with high power-play minutes. I´d love to see him on Wings PP, but not for 6-7M per. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keep Your Stick On the Ice 67 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 No thank you. This organization needs to commit to a multi-year rebuild. 1 chaps80 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fedorovfan 25 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Us not impressed with how Shattenkirk played in the playoffs. Not saying he not good. But, there is room for improvement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hairy Lime 234 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 If they get rid of the salary cap, I'm all in. Outside of that, or him willing to take one of those legendary "Detroit Discounts" my Grandpa once told me about, I'm going to have to take a pass. Too much money for not enough difference. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mackel 763 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Shattenkirk showed he's not "the guy" these playoffs... he's a good piece, but not a linchpin. Someone said solid 2nd pair guy and I agree! For what he'd cost versus what he brings I'd avoid him at all costs. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kliq 3,763 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 1 hour ago, mackel said: Shattenkirk showed he's not "the guy" these playoffs... he's a good piece, but not a linchpin. Someone said solid 2nd pair guy and I agree! For what he'd cost versus what he brings I'd avoid him at all costs. Pretty much this. The only thing I would disagree with is the second pairing part. I think he is a first pair guy, but a low end first pairing guy. I think sometimes people forget that to be a top pairing guy you essentially have to be in the top 62. I think Shattenkirk is a top 62 guy, but he is going to want to be paid like a top 5 guy which is why I want no part in it. Now if he wants to come here for 5 years at 5 million and we can dump a contact like E, i'm game. But its likely going to be 7 year at 8 mil. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shaman 713 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 How would Detroit even pay what he wants? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted May 23, 2017 Every year we hear that guys are going to get a huge deal and they don't. I'm guessing 6 years and just south of $6 mil per.Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk 1 kipwinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 2 hours ago, kliq said: Pretty much this. The only thing I would disagree with is the second pairing part. I think he is a first pair guy, but a low end first pairing guy. I think sometimes people forget that to be a top pairing guy you essentially have to be in the top 62. I think Shattenkirk is a top 62 guy, but he is going to want to be paid like a top 5 guy which is why I want no part in it. Now if he wants to come here for 5 years at 5 million and we can dump a contact like E, i'm game. But its likely going to be 7 year at 8 mil. I guess there are "technically" 62 (with Vegas) "top pair" defensemen in the league, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all 62 are "legit" top pair defensemen. There are several teams (we're probably one of them) that don't have a single legit top pair defenseman. There are some teams with 3, maybe even 4 that would be considered legit top pair defensemen. I think Shattenkirk is a borderline top pair defenseman, but is better suited on the 2nd pair, getting top power-play minutes. But yes, I'd definitely have him ranked somewhere in the top 62, so I guess "technically" he is a "top pair" defenseman... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wingnut1989 165 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 I was never big on shattenkirk, im glad we didnt get him the first time and hope we still dont. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 11 hours ago, krsmith17 said: I wouldn't bank on that. I hope we trade him for a 1st round pick at or before the deadline, but I wouldn't be at all shocked if we re-sign him before then. And honestly, I would much prefer have Green at a similar deal, 2-3 years at $5-6M, than Shattenkirk at 5-7 years at $7+M... Yeah Holland is probably thinking of an extension for him. I hope he ditches him for a first though. No more Green, he hasn't worked out and will be overpaid as well. 7 hours ago, Fedorovfan said: Us not impressed with how Shattenkirk played in the playoffs. Not saying he not good. But, there is room for improvement. Caps underachieved as a whole though. Especially their Vezina winning goalie who is a finalist for it again this year. Just horrible play. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 3 hours ago, Shaman said: How would Detroit even pay what he wants? $6 million in open cap currently. Tatar and AA need extensions, but Tatar can be traded for picks. Sheahan drew interest at the deadline, he can be moved for picks too. Stock up on them. Sign Shattenkirk for $7 million per. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kliq 3,763 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 3 hours ago, krsmith17 said: I guess there are "technically" 62 (with Vegas) "top pair" defensemen in the league, but that doesn't necessarily mean that all 62 are "legit" top pair defensemen. There are several teams (we're probably one of them) that don't have a single legit top pair defenseman. There are some teams with 3, maybe even 4 that would be considered legit top pair defensemen. I think Shattenkirk is a borderline top pair defenseman, but is better suited on the 2nd pair, getting top power-play minutes. But yes, I'd definitely have him ranked somewhere in the top 62, so I guess "technically" he is a "top pair" defenseman... Well just to clarify, I dont think the top 2 D on each team are necessarily top pairing guys, I think the top 62 D are top pairing guys. Some are elite, some are above average, some are below average, some are bad (for top pairing guys). I agree with you in that some teams have zero top pairing guys (the Wings), and some have more then 2 (the Preds) and I pretty much agree with everything you are saying. I think most of us agree that Shattenkirk is going to be paid like a top 10 or top 5 guy, but in reality is not close to that. 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kliq 3,763 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 5 hours ago, DickieDunn said: Every year we hear that guys are going to get a huge deal and they don't. I'm guessing 6 years and just south of $6 mil per. Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk Really? Look at the UFA contracts given out last year. Best example I can give is a a 33 year old David Backes who is a top 6 maybe even top 9 forward getting 5 years 30 million (got 38 points this year in 74 games). Perceived top D-men don't hit UFA often, I admit anything can happen but to think he wont cash in big from someone I think is a bit naive. 3 ChristopherReevesLegs, krsmith17 and chaps80 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,232 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 22 hours ago, chaps80 said: Seems like a very Kenny move to me. He needs a top pairing Dman, and all he needs to do is throw money at him. Typically, money isn't the one and only factor. And even if it is, we're up against the cap and I highly doubt Holland will rearrange the roster just so he can throw max dollars and max term at Kevin Shattenkirk (especially when there are no clear indications that Shattenkirk has any real interest in Detroit). Let's give Holland a little credit here. 21 hours ago, DickieDunn said: He will, and it will be a mistake that hurts the rebuild. For it to be a mistake that hurts the rebuild, it has to actually happen. Holland has to offer a ridiculous contract and Shattenkirk has to accept it. I can't see both of those things happening. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chaps80 1,591 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 For it to be a mistake that hurts the rebuild, it has to actually happen. Holland has to offer a ridiculous contract and Shattenkirk has to accept it. I can't see both of those things happening.He threw almost $6 million per for 6 at a 32 year old Frans Nielson, who he didn't really need. He panicked and jumped. He needed a second line C, but could have found someone worthy of that money before he pulled the trigger, or just waited and made do with what he had. The team was trending downward to rebuild anyhow. He's capable of throwing money at Shattenkirk. Just like he's always been capable of doing. He's bad at the cap game.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,232 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 1 minute ago, chaps80 said: He threw almost $6 million per for 6 at a 32 year old Frans Nielson, who he didn't really need. He panicked and jumped. He needed a second line C, but could have found someone worthy of that money before he pulled the trigger, or just waited and made do with what he had. The team was trending downward to rebuild anyhow. He's capable of throwing money at Shattenkirk. Just like he's always been capable of doing. He's bad at the cap game. Nielsen was meant to replace ("replace") Datsyuk and help extend the playoff streak. I'd like to think the fact that we're now officially a basement team has changed things and that Holland is not going to desperately do everything in his power to sign Kevin Shattenkirk, who isn't necessarily much better than Mike Green and who doesn't appear to be interested in becoming a Wing. Even if Holland does go all out for Shattenkirk, it's no secret that Shattenkirk wants to be a Ranger. Or, at least, that's what the rumors have been saying for the past year and a half. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if he ended up in Edmonton. 2 krsmith17 and kliq reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,232 Report post Posted May 24, 2017 8 hours ago, kliq said: Perceived top D-men don't hit UFA often, I admit anything can happen but to think he wont cash in big from someone I think is a bit naive. Related note: he's basically the only high-end defenseman in this UFA class. http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/free-agents/defenseman/ufa/ Assuming "GMs gonna GM," he's going to get a lot of tasty offers. And he'll have leverage. "Don't wanna give my client what he wants and deserves? Have fun trying to convince your fan base that Dmitry Kulikov is a 'real good' consolation prize." Of course, again, it's widely believed that he has his heart set on NYC. Grew up in New York, was a Rangers fan, reportedly would like to move closer to home, the Rangers need a high-end puck-mover in their top four.... 2 kliq and krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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