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11 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

No.  This is YOUR prediction.  Not fact.  Let me repeat.  NOT FACT.  You are so naive to business dealings, that you have no idea that Ken Holland could very easily negotiate terms of Faulk's extension well before he hits UFA.   Faulk is not Doughty, Karlsson, or Burns.  The whole world recognizes this EXCEPT you, KRS.  If Faulk comes to the wings for a package we are going to not like losing, you can bank on a gentlemens' agreement for hos extension already being in place.

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35 minutes ago, The Datsyukian Deke said:

Great - if Kenny can get that down to 5.5 per, and then give that 6th year, it's absolutely brilliant.

I agree with trying to get that extra year (or three), but Larkin is definitely worth $6M. I'd even go higher if we could get longer term.

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1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree with trying to get that extra year (or three), but Larkin is definitely worth $6M. I'd even go higher if we could get longer term.

I sure was hoping for a more team friendly amount, I must be out of the times.

I happen to think that Mantha gave us a team friendly deal, it would be nice if we could get Dylan for around $5M. I know it's only $1M from the source, but that $1M can be helpful in giving him a better team to play for. If Larkin gets $6, you have to think that Z is LTIR almost for sure.

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56 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Funny how Larkin's holdout is ok.  Athanasiou holds out, he's the devil.

So, negotiating now considered holding out?

Sounds to me like someone needs to be held.

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1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Funny how Larkin's holdout is ok.  Athanasiou holds out, he's the devil.

LOL. That's a good one.

https://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2018/07/red_wings_dylan_larkin_continu_1.html

https://detroit.cbslocal.com/2017/10/18/athanasiou-stunting-his-own-development-with-contract-holdout/

Edited by Neomaxizoomdweebie

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28 minutes ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Media WORDS.  Israeli "freedom fighter" vs. Palestinian "terrorist".  Crazy how people don't see it.  Athanasiou was negotiating, as well.  His negotiation took longer.  Ken Holland's stupidity cost AA 11 games last year.  Hopefully Holland doesn't try and bend over Larkin too. 

Edited by Jonas Mahonas

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29 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Media WORDS.  Israeli "freedom fighter" vs. Palestinian "terrorist".  Crazy how people don't see it.  Athanasiou was negotiating, as well.  His negotiation took longer.  Ken Holland's stupidity cost AA 11 games last year.  Hopefully Holland doesn't try and bend over Larkin too. 

You're probably right, Kenny should've just given AA whatever he demanded, that seems like smart GMing. I'm surprised this needs to be said, but Larkin =/= Athanasiou. One is talking about how he realizes a deal needs to be both beneficial for both himself and the team, the other tried using a KHL offer as leverage. I'll let you figure out why some folks were soured on one but not by the other. 

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1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Media WORDS.  Israeli "freedom fighter" vs. Palestinian "terrorist".  Crazy how people don't see it.  Athanasiou was negotiating, as well.  His negotiation took longer.  Ken Holland's stupidity cost AA 11 games last year.  Hopefully Holland doesn't try and bend over Larkin too. 

That’s two people now who have directly undermined Mabus since his post. 

Edited by kickazz

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1 hour ago, Wheelchairsuperhero said:

You're probably right, Kenny should've just given AA whatever he demanded, that seems like smart GMing. I'm surprised this needs to be said, but Larkin =/= Athanasiou. One is talking about how he realizes a deal needs to be both beneficial for both himself and the team, the other tried using a KHL offer as leverage. I'll let you figure out why some folks were soured on one but not by the other. 

Athanasiou never said a word.  His agent did that.  The same way Larkin's agent is probably using his Fair Market Value as leverage in that negotiation.

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1 hour ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Athanasiou never said a word.  His agent did that.  The same way Larkin's agent is probably using his Fair Market Value as leverage in that negotiation.

The difference is that AA was like one year into his NHL career, hadn't proven anything, was offered a fair deal and balked at it.

Larkin has been in the year for 3 years, has proven himself, and isn't asking for a ridiculous amount, nor is Holland coming in low. A deal hasn't been reached yet because they are working on a long term contract, greater money management and planning is required, cap hits, AAV, salary, term, bonuses, etc. Totally different situation here. They really aren't even comparable.

5 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

I sure was hoping for a more team friendly amount, I must be out of the times.

I happen to think that Mantha gave us a team friendly deal, it would be nice if we could get Dylan for around $5M. I know it's only $1M from the source, but that $1M can be helpful in giving him a better team to play for. If Larkin gets $6, you have to think that Z is LTIR almost for sure.

6 X 6 is a great deal IMO. Just think what guys of Larkin's caliber will be making in years 4-6 of that contract. He's a future 1C and likely team captain. 6 mil is beyond a bargain.

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4 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Athanasiou never said a word.  His agent did that.  The same way Larkin's agent is probably using his Fair Market Value as leverage in that negotiation.

I don't think "the guy I choose to let represent me in the most important negotiations of my life said that, not me" is a valid excuse by any means. Athanasiou was down to wriggle out as much money from the team as possible, despite still being largely unproven at the time (still). It's clear though that you probably won't view him in a negative light, even if he kicked you in the head. It's fine, he's not a bad dude by any means and I still really like him as a player. Comparing him to Larkin is dumb though, at least thus far. 

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3 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

 

6 X 6 is a great deal IMO. Just think what guys of Larkin's caliber will be making in years 4-6 of that contract. He's a future 1C and likely team captain. 6 mil is beyond a bargain.

Couldn't agree more.  

19 minutes ago, Wheelchairsuperhero said:

I don't think "the guy I choose to let represent me in the most important negotiations of my life said that, not me" is a valid excuse by any means. Athanasiou was down to wriggle out as much money from the team as possible, despite still being largely unproven at the time (still). It's clear though that you probably won't view him in a negative light, even if he kicked you in the head. It's fine, he's not a bad dude by any means and I still really like him as a player. Comparing him to Larkin is dumb though, at least thus far. 

Is he supposed to not get the most out of his negotiation?

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3 hours ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

Couldn't agree more.  

Is he supposed to not get the most out of his negotiation?

You're not understanding something simple, I'm not going to try elaborating anymore. You can continue on wondering why some people are soured on AA but not Larkin despite the glaringly obvious reasons, It's fine. I'm not down on AA by any means so I don't want to be sucked into some weird conversation that may make it seem otherwise. 

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5 hours ago, Wheelchairsuperhero said:

You're not understanding something simple, I'm not going to try elaborating anymore. You can continue on wondering why some people are soured on AA but not Larkin despite the glaringly obvious reasons, It's fine. I'm not down on AA by any means so I don't want to be sucked into some weird conversation that may make it seem otherwise. 

It's popular this summer

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A good comparison for the Larkin contract is Ehlers in WPG. Although Dylan is a C and Ehlers is a LW, they had similar numbers last season and for their 3 year careers. Ehlers has him by 22 TTL points. Ehlers has had TWO season's of 60+ points, Dylan only one, plus last 2016-17 was dismal in comparison. But anyhow, Ehlers new contract takes affect this season and it's 7 years $42M, $6M AAV.  That is what most people are expecting Dylan to get, a $6M AAV. I would love to see him settle for a $5M AAV, for 6 years just to get that extra $1M in cap space. Anyhow, it'll probably end up 6yrs $36M and then we will be set, except for clearing cap by waiving Frk or Witko.

Edited by LeftWinger

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4 hours ago, LeftWinger said:

A good comparison for the Larkin contract is Ehlers in WPG. Although Dylan is a C and Ehlers is a LW, they had similar numbers last season and for their 3 year careers. Ehlers has him by 22 TTL points. Ehlers has had TWO season's of 60+ points, Dylan only one, plus last 2016-17 was dismal in comparison. But anyhow, Ehlers new contract takes affect this season and it's 7 years $42M, $6M AAV.  That is what most people are expecting Dylan to get, a $6M AAV. I would love to see him settle for a $5M AAV, for 6 years just to get that extra $1M in cap space. Anyhow, it'll probably end up 6yrs $36M and then we will be set, except for clearing cap by waiving Frk or Witko.

You keep saying this, but it makes no sense to waive either of these players unless you expect a player like Glendening to sit every night (not going to happen). A veteran is not going to sit, so without Frk and Witkowski we'd have one of Athanasiou, Bertuzzi, Rasmussen or Zadina in the press box every night... 

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1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

You keep saying this, but it makes no sense to waive either of these players unless you expect a player like Glendening to sit every night (not going to happen). A veteran is not going to sit, so without Frk and Witkowski we'd have one of Athanasiou, Bertuzzi, Rasmussen or Zadina in the press box every night... 

Without waiving one of them we'll be over the cap, even with Franzen LTIR.

Plus, we'll be so close to the cap after waiving one, we'll still have no cap space for Zadina. Not unless or until Z is done.

So once again we'll be the highest paid team in the NHL and still be a bottom 10 team. Too much money for the UFA's we signed they sucked up all the cap.

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