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Mrazek traded to Philly for Conditional 3rd and 4th Picks

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2 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

3 games with Philly and he has 1.3 GAA and 0.947 Sv %

Did we make a mistake? Was Howard the wrong choice?

Great stats, but Philly have also won 6 in a row, and 10 out of the last 11. They're on fire. Mraz probably helps, but isn't what's winning them games.

For comparison:

Howard: 917 sv%, 2.6 GAA in his last 5, also with 31.6 Shots Against (158 total) compared with Mraz's 25.3 Shots Against (total 76 in 3 games). Howard just faces a lot more shots (understandable).

Taking Mrazek's last 5 games (3 with Philly, 2 with Detroit), he's faced 28, 28, 20, 34, 32. We give up a lot of shots consistently.

Unfortunately we won't know if we made a mistake until after both guys are done.

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4 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

3 games with Philly and he has 1.3 GAA and 0.947 Sv %

Did we make a mistake? Was Howard the wrong choice?

If we trade them Howard instead, we get Gostisbehere. and Provorov... I'm pretty sure that’s how that works. 

Maybe we can get them to throw in Patrick too? :P 

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29 minutes ago, The Datsyukian Deke said:

Let's wait and see...3 games isnt that much of a sample size. ;)

While true, he's been quite good for nearly two months now. All season long he has shown signs of improvement, just never had the playing time to find himself in a groove until January. 

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11 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

3 games with Philly and he has 1.3 GAA and 0.947 Sv %

Did we make a mistake? Was Howard the wrong choice?

I know this is likely sarcasm, but yes, yes we did make a mistake trading Mrazek and keeping Howard...

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10 hours ago, Wing Across The Pond said:

Great stats, but Philly have also won 6 in a row, and 10 out of the last 11. They're on fire. Mraz probably helps, but isn't what's winning them games.

For comparison:

Howard: 917 sv%, 2.6 GAA in his last 5, also with 31.6 Shots Against (158 total) compared with Mraz's 25.3 Shots Against (total 76 in 3 games). Howard just faces a lot more shots (understandable).

Taking Mrazek's last 5 games (3 with Philly, 2 with Detroit), he's faced 28, 28, 20, 34, 32. We give up a lot of shots consistently.

Unfortunately we won't know if we made a mistake until after both guys are done.

Ok sweet no mistakes made

1 hour ago, krsmith17 said:

I know this is likely sarcasm, but yes, yes we did make a mistake trading Mrazek and keeping Howard...

yeah yeah yeah we made a mistake trading Smith too, I've heard it

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2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

I know this is likely sarcasm, but yes, yes we did make a mistake trading Mrazek and keeping Howard...

Let's turn the argument around. We can't trade both. We should trade one, for two reasons (at the least):

* Their total salary sum is excessive with no basis in regards to our current situation.

* Given our progress curve on how likely we are to make the finals, one should be traded. In short, we need a prospect up. Or a bad backup.

Mrazek was the easiest to trade. He is younger, has shown flashes of brilliance and was on the incline.

Do I like it? Slightly no. Does it matter, judging from our team, in a snapshot of the present? Not a bit.

Opinion: trade both, I'd say. But I do understand if that seems harsh.

Edited by Jacksoni

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36 minutes ago, Jacksoni said:

Let's turn the argument around. We can't trade both. We should trade one, for two reasons (at the least):

* Their total salary sum is excessive with no basis in regards to our current situation.

* Given our progress curve on how likely we are to make the finals, one should be traded. In short, we need a prospect up. Or a bad backup.

Mrazek was the easiest to trade. He is younger, has shown flashes of brilliance and was on the incline.

Do I like it? Slightly no. Does it matter, judging from our team, in a snapshot of the present? Not a bit.

Opinion: trade both, I'd say. But I do understand if that seems harsh.

We can trade both, but we shouldn't trade both. Howard should have been the one traded though.

Their "total salary sum"? Howard's salary (cap hit) is higher. *For a team rebuilding* we should have traded the more expensive / (one year longer) contract. Our "progress curve"? Howard is much older with no upside. Mrazek is younger with upside. *For a team rebuilding* we should have traded the older goalie.

You're damn right Mrazek was easier to trade. You know why? Because of the reasons I just mentioned. Better contract, younger, and more upside. Athanasiou would be easier to trade than Helm too. Does that mean we should trade him?

"In a snapshot of the present" it doesn't matter that we traded Mrazek? Mrazek shouldn't have just been viewed as the goalie of "the present", but maybe, just maybe, the goalie of the future.

I'm not saying Mrazek should have been untouchable, but we should have never given him away for a (maybe two) mid round draft pick(s).

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I don’t even really dislike the deal in terms of the return, but I think Mrazek was mismanaged and unless he somehow sneaks back into the fold this summer as a UFA, I think this was a dumb move. As I’ve said all along, we are sorely lacking in prospects with his upside. He squandered a lot of good faith, but beggars can’t be choosers unless they want to live with regret. I think there’s a high likelihood we’ll regret this one. 

And f***, Mrazek has been good in the playoffs. That’s what really kills me. He seems to have that rare extra gear. Will be interesting to see how he plays with Philly in the playoffs. 

Edited by gcom007

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39 minutes ago, gcom007 said:

I don’t even really dislike the deal in terms of the return, but I think Mrazek was mismanaged and unless he somehow sneaks back into the fold this summer as a UFA, I think this was a dumb move. As I’ve said all along, we are sorely lacking in prospects with his upside. He squandered a lot of good faith, but beggars can’t be choosers unless they want to live with regret. I think there’s a high likelihood we’ll regret this one. 

And f***, Mrazek has been good in the playoffs. That’s what really kills me. He seems to have that rare extra gear. Will be interesting to see how he plays with Philly in the playoffs. 

I’ve said all I can about the mismanagement and very low level of patience with him and ridiculous timeline he was given on a rebuilding team. 

If he keeps playing like he is, I can see him getting re-signed by Philly. Neuvirth is way too injury prone and unreliable. Might not even have to qualify him if they can get him to decline and agree to a longer contract for less, like was done with Mason. I think he’d be more open to considering that there.

If he hits UFA, he’s not coming back to Detroit to battle it out with Howard and deal with Holland again. What’s done is done. If Holland made a mistake, he can’t fix it.

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16 hours ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

3 games with Philly and he has 1.3 GAA and 0.947 Sv %

Did we make a mistake? Was Howard the wrong choice?

Yes, but Petr made his bed with Holland. There was no saving him, he should have been the hands down goalie protected at the draft and he should've been the hands down starter, but when he had a bad stretch and Jimmy took over, he got irked and probably ran his mouth a bit.  Got in the doghouse with the GM and you just knew that even IF Howard would've brought back a better return, Petr was the one who was getting traded. If he hadn't been traded, Holland was prepared to let him walk in the summer. His pee-peed in Hollands Oat Bran and that was it.

But yes, Mrazek is the better goalie and had even more potential. I just wish he would've been more professional. Oh well, we see now...of course I do believe Philly has a bit better D in front of him.

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We also have to remember Howard does have the M-NTC, maybe Philly and NYI were not on his list of 10 teams he'd go to.  Come July 1, all that goes away, he could wind up in Arizona if they have a good offer!

July 2nd, 2018 Howard for Domi straight up!

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14 hours ago, Wing Across The Pond said:

Great stats, but Philly have also won 6 in a row, and 10 out of the last 11. They're on fire. Mraz probably helps, but isn't what's winning them games.

For comparison:

Howard: 917 sv%, 2.6 GAA in his last 5, also with 31.6 Shots Against (158 total) compared with Mraz's 25.3 Shots Against (total 76 in 3 games). Howard just faces a lot more shots (understandable).

Taking Mrazek's last 5 games (3 with Philly, 2 with Detroit), he's faced 28, 28, 20, 34, 32. We give up a lot of shots consistently.

Unfortunately we won't know if we made a mistake until after both guys are done.

Mrazek was pretty crucial to their shootout win in the last game. Another shutout, and allowed only one goal in the shootout. Was a dual with Lindgren the whole way. Of course he’s helping them win games. He’s facing less shots there, but that doesn’t mean anything. He’s shown he can handle more many times.

I know your trying to find a bright side, but not much there really.

Edited by chaps80

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2 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Once we all out of the playoffs, I say give Coreau all the starts, A. To help us possibly tank, 2. To see if he can handle the NHL game and C. The make Jimmy expendable over the summer to help tank for Jack Hughes!

 

I agree. Gotta see if Coreau is even an option. If not, have to sign a backup in summer.

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13 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Yes, but Petr made his bed with Holland. There was no saving him, he should have been the hands down goalie protected at the draft and he should've been the hands down starter, but when he had a bad stretch and Jimmy took over, he got irked and probably ran his mouth a bit.  Got in the doghouse with the GM and you just knew that even IF Howard would've brought back a better return, Petr was the one who was getting traded. If he hadn't been traded, Holland was prepared to let him walk in the summer. His pee-peed in Hollands Oat Bran and that was it.

But yes, Mrazek is the better goalie and had even more potential. I just wish he would've been more professional. Oh well, we see now...of course I do believe Philly has a bit better D in front of him.

IF Holland is doing his job with his personal feelings being the major factor in decisions like this, he’s gotta be canned. That’s not how to do things. It’s pretty scary actually. But I guess he’s used to drafted players wanting to stay in Detroit and caving to his contract offers to do so. That’s not going to work anymore when your team sucks.

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3 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

We can trade both, but we shouldn't trade both. Howard should have been the one traded though.

Their "total salary sum"? Howard's salary (cap hit) is higher. *For a team rebuilding* we should have traded the more expensive / (one year longer) contract. Our "progress curve"? Howard is much older with no upside. Mrazek is younger with upside. *For a team rebuilding* we should have traded the older goalie.

You're damn right Mrazek was easier to trade. You know why? Because of the reasons I just mentioned. Better contract, younger, and more upside. Athanasiou would be easier to trade than Helm too. Does that mean we should trade him?

"In a snapshot of the present" it doesn't matter that we traded Mrazek? Mrazek shouldn't have just been viewed as the goalie of "the present", but maybe, just maybe, the goalie of the future.

I'm not saying Mrazek should have been untouchable, but we should have never given him away for a (maybe two) mid round draft pick(s).

 

1 hour ago, LeftWinger said:

Yes, but Petr made his bed with Holland. There was no saving him, he should have been the hands down goalie protected at the draft and he should've been the hands down starter, but when he had a bad stretch and Jimmy took over, he got irked and probably ran his mouth a bit.  Got in the doghouse with the GM and you just knew that even IF Howard would've brought back a better return, Petr was the one who was getting traded. If he hadn't been traded, Holland was prepared to let him walk in the summer. His pee-peed in Hollands Oat Bran and that was it.

But yes, Mrazek is the better goalie and had even more potential. I just wish he would've been more professional. Oh well, we see now...of course I do believe Philly has a bit better D in front of him.

This is all just speculation.

Is Mrazek the easier contract to move and that's why Holland traded him? Maybe
Is Howard the better goalie, and who Holland preferred to keep, and that's why Mrazek was traded? Maybe
Does Holland have the emotional stability and spitefulness of a 5 year old, and traded Mrazek because of negotiations a few years ago? Maybe
Is Mrazek utter cancer in the locker-room and that's why he was traded? Maybe
Did Holland just wanna get what he could for a guy he knew would hit UFA in the summer? Probably

At the end of day you're all just butt-hurt cause ya golden boi is gone lol keep the tears comin
 

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1 minute ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

 

This is all just speculation.

Is Mrazek the easier contract to move and that's why Holland traded him? Maybe
Is Howard the better goalie, and who Holland preferred to keep, and that's why Mrazek was traded? Maybe
Does Holland have the emotional stability and spitefulness of a 5 year old, and traded Mrazek because of negotiations a few years ago? Maybe
Is Mrazek utter cancer in the locker-room and that's why he was traded? Maybe
Did Holland just wanna get what he could for a guy he knew would hit UFA in the summer? Probably

At the end of day you're all just butt-hurt cause ya golden boi is gone lol keep the tears comin
 

I am not anywhere near butthurt.  If you look over all the threads (no I do not expect you to) I maintained the stance of trade the one that brings back the most, or both.  I would have rather kept Mrazek, but like I said, he made his bed with Holland. Yes, he became a bad teammate (rumored) Yes I fully believe that Holland holds grudges, yes, Holland wanted to try to get something for a goalie that he was not going to qualify, heck he tried to give him away at the expansion draft, and I think there was an Edmonton rumor earlier in the season as well. Yes, Mrazek being younger, his RFA status, it was an easier contract to move. But no, I think if none of the above happened (hold out, bad teammate, etc..) and Mrazek acted professional, I think he would've preferred to keep Petr, Howard probably would've been the one left unprotected and Howard (if not able to be dealt at deadline) probably would've been bought out in June. But as we all know, Petr became all that, acted unprofessional and in the end, will probably end up in a better situation for it...but no, I, of all Mrazek supporters, am not in one bit, butthurt. I like the return too!

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3 hours ago, chaps80 said:

IF Holland is doing his job with his personal feelings being the major factor in decisions like this, he’s gotta be canned. That’s not how to do things. It’s pretty scary actually. But I guess he’s used to drafted players wanting to stay in Detroit and caving to his contract offers to do so. That’s not going to work anymore when your team sucks.

Holland doesn't do business that way. He's management,its a business. If anything, his fault is that he let's loyalty factor into his business dealings. Funny how people complain (not you necessarily) about Holland being too loyal to his players ( Clearly, Franzen, Howard, etc) and then also complain that he treats his players poorly (Mrazek, AA). Which is it?

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1 hour ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Holland doesn't do business that way. He's management,its a business. If anything, his fault is that he let's loyalty factor into his business dealings. Funny how people complain (not you necessarily) about Holland being too loyal to his players ( Clearly, Franzen, Howard, etc) and then also complain that he treats his players poorly (Mrazek, AA). Which is it?

"Loyalty to the veterans and not the kids."

f*** the kids. What the hell have they done to earn anything? Build your track record first, then we'll talk about giving you loyalty.

Godam millennials acting like they're owed something. 

Edited by kickazz

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3 hours ago, Neomaxizoomdweebie said:

Holland doesn't do business that way. He's management,its a business. If anything, his fault is that he let's loyalty factor into his business dealings. Funny how people complain (not you necessarily) about Holland being too loyal to his players ( Clearly, Franzen, Howard, etc) and then also complain that he treats his players poorly (Mrazek, AA). Which is it?

It’s a perfectly s***ty cocktail of both. Guaranteed to give you  headaches for the next few years.

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