2023 Offseason Thread

[Jonas Mahonas 1,872]

2 hours ago, AtlantaHotWings said:

Looks like Boston is planning that Bergeron and Krejci are done soo does this affect the pick from Boston significantly?

https://www.tsn.ca/nhl/boston-bruins-unlikely-to-re-sign-dmitry-orlov-patrice-bergeron-and-david-krejci-might-not-return-1.1977999

 

no chance.  they will be back.

[LeftWinger 4,963]

Reilly Smith only cost a 3rd. I know he's older than Debrincat, but production is similar. Plus, you know, Cup Champion. I wonder how this affects the market for Debrincat? It might not but It should....

[Axl Foley 227]

What is the point of Klim and Kailer? The former is nothing more than a depth center. The latter is a redundant bottom 6 F. How does this help our scoring?

[Akakabuto 1,751]

3 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

What is the point of Klim and Kailer? The former is nothing more than a depth center. The latter is a redundant bottom 6 F. How does this help our scoring?

Replacing Erne and Suter? idk

We still have room for one or two forward additions

 

[bIueadams 776]

44 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

The former is nothing more than a depth center.

Yes

44 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

The latter is a redundant bottom 6 F.

Uh huh

45 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

How does this help our scoring?

You expected bottom 6ers to help our scoring? 

I mean K and K is better scoring depth than Suter, Erne, Veleno, or Zadina. But yeah, these are depth moves. You mad SY didnt get Dcat yet or something?

[AtlantaHotWings 994]

7 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

I mean K and K is better scoring depth than Suter, Erne, Veleno, or Zadina. But yeah, these are depth moves. You mad SY didnt get Dcat yet or something?

Not mad interested why the seeming pullback on both sides. Its like getting all hot and bothered and both parties don't take to the backseat of the car.

Did the Sens push to hard and Stevie said f it I can wait till next year. Thus letting the Sens stew and have to deal with an unhappy player for a year?

Having set that scenario in place he is now working on Konecny ?

July 1 could be interesting

EIther way Zadina is still here........yahoo

[town123 177]

 I think both K & K will be good for the Wings.   They cost nothing and we have to hit the cap floor.   Yam might be okay speed for depth on our 3-4th line, but Klim should be a fan favourite by November for those who think our team is ***** personified.    I think he plays a great physical game that I think is missing on our team.

[F.Michael 4,590]

1 hour ago, town123 said:

 I think both K & K will be good for the Wings.   They cost nothing and we have to hit the cap floor.   Yam might be okay speed for depth on our 3-4th line, but Klim should be a fan favourite by November for those who think our team is ***** personified.    I think he plays a great physical game that I think is missing on our team.

Having proud Japanese blood flowing thru him I would expect nothing less than seppuku at center ice if his 2023/2024 performance were not up to par.

[bIueadams 776]

1 hour ago, AtlantaHotWings said:

Not mad interested why the seeming pullback on both sides. Its like getting all hot and bothered and both parties don't take to the backseat of the car.

Did the Sens push to hard and Stevie said f it I can wait till next year. Thus letting the Sens stew and have to deal with an unhappy player for a year?

Having set that scenario in place he is now working on Konecny ?

July 1 could be interesting

EIther way Zadina is still here........yahoo

I dont think youll see Dcat or Konecny coming here unless its dirt cheap. Which philly and ottawa wont do, so it wont happen.

SY is still in no rush to win. The Yam and Kostin deal is evidence of that. Hed still rather take free stuff, then spend our futures on nicer stuff.

1 hour ago, town123 said:

 I think both K & K will be good for the Wings.   They cost nothing and we have to hit the cap floor.   Yam might be okay speed for depth on our 3-4th line, but Klim should be a fan favourite by November for those who think our team is ***** personified.    I think he plays a great physical game that I think is missing on our team.

Yeah both are good depth additions. Kostin is basically the best of Erne and Suter combined into one. And i think the change of scenery for Yam will do well for Yam. When he went dry in Edm he got very few chances to earn his spot back.

[Axl Foley 227]

2 hours ago, bIueadams said:

Yes

Uh huh

You expected bottom 6ers to help our scoring? 

I mean K and K is better scoring depth than Suter, Erne, Veleno, or Zadina. But yeah, these are depth moves. You mad SY didnt get Dcat yet or something?

Not mad at all. Just thought it was an unnecessary move to acquire underachieving former 1st round picks for the bottom six when the biggest need is scoring. They should fit right in with Zadina and Veleno.

Edited June 29, 2023 by Axl Foley

[F.Michael 4,590]

1 minute ago, Axl Foley said:

Not mad at all. Just thought it was an unnecessary move to acquire underachieving former 1st round picks for the bottom six when the biggest need is scoring. They should fit right in with Zadina and Veleno.

But the thought of losing both Zadina AND Veleno for Debrincat...

[Axl Foley 227]

1 minute ago, F.Michael said:

But the thought of losing both Zadina AND Veleno for Debrincat...

It's like Steve is acquiring former 1st round disappointments. Remember Juolevi? Gagner?

[bIueadams 776]

56 minutes ago, Axl Foley said:

Not mad at all. Just thought it was an unnecessary move to acquire underachieving former 1st round picks for the bottom six when the biggest need is scoring. They should fit right in with Zadina and Veleno.

You do know the bottom six still exists whether you need scoring or not right? Are you gonna be confused when SY signs a backup goalie cause we need scoring??

Yamamotto + Kostin >>> Erne + Suter

The bottom 6 also lost Sundqvist in Feb.

And Yamamotto can add 35-40 pts from the bottom 6. Who knows how much more if we can get him going in the top 6.

Im beyond confused why u r at all confused by this deal.

1 hour ago, Axl Foley said:

It's like Steve is acquiring former 1st round disappointments. Remember Juolevi? Gagner?

More like remember Fabbri?

Juolevi was a multi waived long shot and Gagner was well into his 30s established bottom 6er when we grabbed them

[Axl Foley 227]

4 minutes ago, bIueadams said:

You do know the bottom six still exists whether you need scoring or not right? Are you gonna be confused when SY signs a backup goalie cause we need scoring??

Yamamotto + Kostin >>> Erne + Suter

The bottom 6 also lost Sundqvist in Feb.

And Yamamotto can add 35-40 pts from the bottom 6. Who knows how much more if we can get him going in the top 6.

Im beyond confused why u r at all confused by this deal.

More like remember Fabbri?

Juolevi was a multi waived long shot and Gagner was well into his 30s established bottom 6er when we grabbed them

Fabbri has actually been a good middle 6 winger. Not disappointed at all.

Um. yeah. I realize you still need bottom 6 forwards. We have plenty already. Without the trade, you still had Rasmussen, Kubalik, Fabbri, Veleno, and Zadina in the bottom 6 already without adding Kasper or Soderblom to the roster. Your top 6 is now Larkin, Raymond, Copp, Perron, Berggren. We didn't need more bottom 6 forwards, we needed 2 top 6 wingers to replace Vrana and Bertuzzi. Suter, Erne, and Sundqvist were replaceable from within. Adding more bottom 6 forwards just pushes guys up into the top 6 that don't belong there.

Of course, Yzerman could make a trade for a top 6 forward and include one of those lower players in the deal. Which is why I never said it was a mistake or a bad trade. I just questioned the logic behind it because it seemed redundant.

And no, I wouldn't question getting another goalie since that's, y'know, an actual hole in the roster.

[bIueadams 776]

2 hours ago, Axl Foley said:

Fabbri has actually been a good middle 6 winger. Not disappointed at all.

Um. yeah. I realize you still need bottom 6 forwards. We have plenty already. Without the trade, you still had Rasmussen, Kubalik, Fabbri, Veleno, and Zadina in the bottom 6 already without adding Kasper or Soderblom to the roster. Your top 6 is now Larkin, Raymond, Copp, Perron, Berggren. We didn't need more bottom 6 forwards, we needed 2 top 6 wingers to replace Vrana and Bertuzzi. Suter, Erne, and Sundqvist were replaceable from within. Adding more bottom 6 forwards just pushes guys up into the top 6 that don't belong there.

Of course, Yzerman could make a trade for a top 6 forward and include one of those lower players in the deal. Which is why I never said it was a mistake or a bad trade. I just questioned the logic behind it because it seemed redundant.

And no, I wouldn't question getting another goalie since that's, y'know, an actual hole in the roster.

I think you're intentionally skewing your roster evaluation to try and save your argument, and you misunderstand the state of the rebuild.

First, Rasmussen and Kubalik are very much middle 6 at this point and flirting, with fulltime top 6 roles.

Ras's move to wing was the best thing that ever happened to him, and he had a very quality top6 2nd half of the season. Unless Yzerman signs someone better for that role, Ras is probably our #1 LW going into the season.

Not sure if you recall, but sometime at the beginning of last season you and I argued about Kubs. I argued Kubs should never be in the top6 unless someone like Bertuzzi or Vrana are out (they were at that time) and you stuck up for Kubs being a legit middle 6 forward. You won that one, cause Kubs proved me wrong. His chemistry with Larkin and Perron is undeniable. I would gladly demote Raymond and Ras to the 2nd line with Copp to recapture that. Then he was one of the bests players in the tournament at worlds this year. This guys confidence is back in a big way since coming to Detroit.

Fabbri has played a middle 6 role (more often on the 2nd line) since being here and you know that.

Veleno and Zadina aren't bottom 6 forwards either... they should both be extra forwards, 13 & 14. They provide absolute nothing to the team besides the warmth of their flesh. I'd play Chiasson over both, and he's an extra forward. Luckily the Veleno and Zadina experiment is in its twilight at this point.

So the roster looks like this:

Ras - Larkin - Raymond
Kubalik - Copp - Perron
Fabbri - Kostin - Yamamotto
Berggren - _____ - ______
Veleno/Zadina

We cannot count on Kasper and Soderblom to make the roster at camp. IMO I think Kasper will, and Soder will not, but regardless you must plan like they won't. Prospects don't given spots, they have to steal/earn one.

Fabbri is also in questionable health with his knees. I'm not sure how much of him anyone expects next season.

Long story short - there are still plenty of openings on this team.

Personally, I like the physical defensive presence Kostin is going to bring, but I DO NOT want him as the regular 3C. I'm expecting SY to pull another Kubalik/Suter creative move to bring in a younger 3C that can both force Kostin down, and nip at Copp's heels.

Berggren probably ends up taking the injured Fabbri's 3LW spot and competes with Kubs and Ras for the top 6 roles.

Yamamotto is fine on the 3rd line, and can serve as the middle 6 when either Perron or Ray get injured.

The guy I kinda want for that open 4RW role is Garnet Hathaway. Bruins are letting him go. He and Kostin on the 4th would bring the violence this team has been lacking for years. 

Sorry for pontificating, but lastly I think you misunderstand the state of the rebuild in Yzerman's mind. He hasn't sacrificed futures to bring in legit players yet, and he's still not. This Yamamotto/Kostin should be your canary in the coal mine for that. He's not at the stage where he's ready to sacrifice drafting ASP (and more) for Debrincat. He's going to find cheap creative options, create a thunderdome of competing for spots within the roster, and probably sell Perron and Kubs at the deadline this year. We're still doing the long plan. 

I don't think SY will willingly hit the accelerator until this team makes the playoffs on their own. Once they accomplish that, he will seek to aid them, till then have fun waiting and growing while he provides the creative cheap options he can.

SY would probably disagree on some of my evaluation, but he also pulled the Yam/Kostin trade, and he's not infallible, but it was an absolute gift horse. I fail to see why anyone would question him on it. I liked Holland, but SY is a whole other level.  

[GMRwings1983 8,794]

15 hours ago, F.Michael said:

Having proud Japanese blood flowing thru him I would expect nothing less than seppuku at center ice if his 2023/2024 performance were not up to par.

We need one more Japanese forward to pair with Hirose and Yamamoto.

[F.Michael 4,590]

14 minutes ago, GMRwings1983 said:

We need one more Japanese forward to pair with Hirose and Yamamoto.

If we managed to find another player with Japanese ancestry - how politically incorrect would it be to refer them as the “Kamikaze” line?

[bIueadams 776]

1 hour ago, GMRwings1983 said:

We need one more Japanese forward to pair with Hirose and Yamamoto.

Now we have ****, krauts, and italians... and swedish and swiss colaboraters...

[TLGTrico 627]

2 hours ago, GMRwings1983 said:

We need one more Japanese forward to pair with Hirose and Yamamoto.

Hate to break it to you but yamamoto's getting bought out

[bIueadams 776]

5 minutes ago, TLGTrico said:

Hate to break it to you but yamamoto's getting bought out

Dreger reporting Wings would have liked to keep him but couldnt make other moves to make it work. Need the cap space.

Really cheap buyout so no big deal. I also like that SY apparently intends to use his cap space. Hoping we get Graves and more tomorrow.

[LeftWinger 4,963]

I'm a little disappointed that Yamamoto won't get a chance here. I'm not gonna lie.

[AtlantaHotWings 994]

this is happy news

 

[Axl Foley 227]

On 6/30/2023 at 12:38 AM, bIueadams said:

I think you're intentionally skewing your roster evaluation to try and save your argument, and you misunderstand the state of the rebuild.

First, Rasmussen and Kubalik are very much middle 6 at this point and flirting, with fulltime top 6 roles.

Ras's move to wing was the best thing that ever happened to him, and he had a very quality top6 2nd half of the season. Unless Yzerman signs someone better for that role, Ras is probably our #1 LW going into the season.

Not sure if you recall, but sometime at the beginning of last season you and I argued about Kubs. I argued Kubs should never be in the top6 unless someone like Bertuzzi or Vrana are out (they were at that time) and you stuck up for Kubs being a legit middle 6 forward. You won that one, cause Kubs proved me wrong. His chemistry with Larkin and Perron is undeniable. I would gladly demote Raymond and Ras to the 2nd line with Copp to recapture that. Then he was one of the bests players in the tournament at worlds this year. This guys confidence is back in a big way since coming to Detroit.

Fabbri has played a middle 6 role (more often on the 2nd line) since being here and you know that.

Veleno and Zadina aren't bottom 6 forwards either... they should both be extra forwards, 13 & 14. They provide absolute nothing to the team besides the warmth of their flesh. I'd play Chiasson over both, and he's an extra forward. Luckily the Veleno and Zadina experiment is in its twilight at this point.

So the roster looks like this:

Ras - Larkin - Raymond
Kubalik - Copp - Perron
Fabbri - Kostin - Yamamotto
Berggren - _____ - ______
Veleno/Zadina

We cannot count on Kasper and Soderblom to make the roster at camp. IMO I think Kasper will, and Soder will not, but regardless you must plan like they won't. Prospects don't given spots, they have to steal/earn one.

Fabbri is also in questionable health with his knees. I'm not sure how much of him anyone expects next season.

Long story short - there are still plenty of openings on this team.

Personally, I like the physical defensive presence Kostin is going to bring, but I DO NOT want him as the regular 3C. I'm expecting SY to pull another Kubalik/Suter creative move to bring in a younger 3C that can both force Kostin down, and nip at Copp's heels.

Berggren probably ends up taking the injured Fabbri's 3LW spot and competes with Kubs and Ras for the top 6 roles.

Yamamotto is fine on the 3rd line, and can serve as the middle 6 when either Perron or Ray get injured.

The guy I kinda want for that open 4RW role is Garnet Hathaway. Bruins are letting him go. He and Kostin on the 4th would bring the violence this team has been lacking for years. 

Sorry for pontificating, but lastly I think you misunderstand the state of the rebuild in Yzerman's mind. He hasn't sacrificed futures to bring in legit players yet, and he's still not. This Yamamotto/Kostin should be your canary in the coal mine for that. He's not at the stage where he's ready to sacrifice drafting ASP (and more) for Debrincat. He's going to find cheap creative options, create a thunderdome of competing for spots within the roster, and probably sell Perron and Kubs at the deadline this year. We're still doing the long plan. 

I don't think SY will willingly hit the accelerator until this team makes the playoffs on their own. Once they accomplish that, he will seek to aid them, till then have fun waiting and growing while he provides the creative cheap options he can.

SY would probably disagree on some of my evaluation, but he also pulled the Yam/Kostin trade, and he's not infallible, but it was an absolute gift horse. I fail to see why anyone would question him on it. I liked Holland, but SY is a whole other level.  

Kubalik and Rasmussen are middle 6 wingers. They're fine playing most of the time on the 3rd line, but full time in the top 6 means this team lacks some offensive punch yet.

Kubalik was Franzen-like. He would string together some offense, then dry up for long stretches of time. He plays well when he has good linemates. He struggles without it. I am fine with him in the top 6 short term to gain value for the TDL, but if he is in Detroit long term, he should be pushed down the lineup.

Now Yamamoto is gone, so SY traded for a player he now has to pay for that isnt even on the roster.

[Axl Foley 227]

On 6/30/2023 at 1:14 PM, bIueadams said:

Dreger reporting Wings would have liked to keep him but couldnt make other moves to make it work. Need the cap space.

Really cheap buyout so no big deal. I also like that SY apparently intends to use his cap space. Hoping we get Graves and more tomorrow.

He doesn't sign Yamamoto because he needs cap space, but then doesn't sign anyone significant to use the cap space. More confusion here. He could have just kept him on the roster until the contract ran out.

Edited July 1, 2023 by Axl Foley

[ely s 457]

13 hours ago, Axl Foley said:

He doesn't sign Yamamoto because he needs cap space, but then doesn't sign anyone significant to use the cap space. More confusion here. He could have just kept him on the roster until the contract ran out.

He didn´t sign him because he´s 5´8" and nothing special. If you want to be harder to play against, add size not midgets. He was just a cap dump from Holland for the signing rights of Kostin. I think Yzerman never wanted Yamamoto to block any roster spots.