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I think this off-season will go very far in defining Ken Holland as a GM. It will show whether his inactivity at the last 2 trade deadlines and last summer were smart move (saving cap and roster space for a big free agent push this summer) or if he lacks the ability or desire to make necessary changes to the makeup of his club in order to stay competitive. I've been pretty critical of Holland's moves (or more specifically, lack thereof) when it appears the Wings are stale and in need of a wakeup call. I feel he's hung on to some players for too long (Chelios, Maltby, Holmstrom, and now Bertuzzi) at the expense of critical NHL development time for some of the younger players, I think he lets prospects sit in Grand Rapids for too long--Brendan Smith should have been with the Wings for most, if not all, of last season and basically been Nick Lidstrom's shadow, playing with him in all situations (what better way to learn??), and I can't take him seriously when he says he expects his team to compete for the Stanley Cup every year, but there are no repercussions for players who woefully underperform when the team falls short (i.e., nobody "essential" gets traded away, which sends a message to all remaining players). I can't give credit to Holland (as GM) for the '97 or '98 Cups, as he was in the process of being handed that team just as they reached the top of the league. The '98 team was on a mission after the limo accident. The '02 Cup, he'll get credit, but he had Ilitch's open bank vault and fit the right pieces into place. The '08 Cup and '09 final, that's all him. 21 straight playoff appearances is very impressive. But the last 4 Cup champs were teams that missed the playoffs in the first season after the lockout, and 3 of the 4 Conference finalists this year missed the playoffs that season. Those teams have had better chances to restock their systems with higher draft picks. In my opinion, Holland cannot afford to miss out on the best players available, whether it's through free agency or trade. Time for change, time for improvement.

I don't know about make it or break it, but I think this is the biggest test of his career as GM.

Right or wrong, success is measured by lots of people in Cups. If Holland gets one of Parise or Suter and we get a Cup, he will be hailed as a genius for getting the right one. If we don't get a Cup, many will be second guessing him and saying he got the wrong one. If both go for insanely high prices and he just failed to overpay, some will say it was a shrewd move and others will decry him for not trying hard enough. These are not all people, of course, but it seems like a lot of people have a "what have you done for me lately?" mentality. Look at Rafalski. He was hailed, then scorned, then respected in retrospect. I don't think that the moves Holland makes this summer will seal his legacy, but he has a good opportunity to add pieces we need to get another Cup or two. If he does well, and we get at least one Cup, people will use this summer to make a case for his greatness, but I wouldn't say that when we look back it will difinitively make or break him. EDIT: Unless he gets Parise, Suter, and trades everyone we don't like for someone a jillion times better and signs them cheap. Then it will make him the greatest, but I don't see that realistically happening. Just had to add it for completeness of thought. EDIT 2: Blast! I miss spellcheck!

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Well, if he lands Suter and Parise and we win the Cup, I think it will cement his legacy as a HoF GM. If he lands neither, and we miss the playoffs or exit early it will tarnish his image in the short term (unfairly), but long term he will still be remembered as one of the best. Remember, he was also assistant GM for 3 years, and director of amatuer scouting for 7 before that. He played a significant role in building the team he "inherited". He's also made some big moves that people consider "failures" just because they didn't result in a Cup. Hossa, Hatcher, Clark/Samuelsson/Ranford, Cujo, Lang... He's also facing an uphill battle. We may need some big signing or trade, but that doesn't make doing it any easier. There's one real impact defenseman who might be available, and about 20 teams with the desire and ability to make a good offer for him. We have some assets to trade, but that doesn't mean any teams with the players we want will make those players available or be interested in what we can offer. Fact is, if Red Wings fans judged other teams or GMs by the same standard Kenny has to live up to, they'd all be considered abject failures. We just lost the best defenseman of our generation, plus Stu, Rafi last year. Our stars are in their 30s. We haven't had any high draft picks during his tenure. We've dealt with the loss of stars and key roleplayers, like Konstantinov, Hasek, Yzerman, Hull, Fedorov, Robitaille, Shanahan, Chelios, Draper, Maltby, Osgood, Fischer, and more without needing to rebuild. And we are still talking about making moves to keep us a Cup contender rather than about rebuilding. That says alot more about Kenny than anything that might happen July 1st or afterward. But if we don't make any big moves, and Kenny says, like last summer or the deadline, "We wanted to make some moves, but could find one that fit. But we like our team." everyone will just jump on the "we like our team" bit. As if all the best FAs offered to play here for free and every other GM offered to trade us their best players for our worst and Kenny turned them down. It's like half this board thinks the rest of the league has to get Kenny's permission before they can do anything, and the only reason we haven't done more already is because we didn't want to.

1. Hot BBQ 2. Wild 3. Spicy Garlic 4. Asian Zing 5. Hot Of the current Red Wings though, a combination of Hank, Pavs, Kronner, Helm, & Howie.

Except he loves to take dumb penalties and his defensive game is still pretty rough.

I first noticed White when he played against us in San Jose and thought he was a great little player. When we poicked him up I was so happy, I think White has been a fantastic addition. Low cost, high energy, gives his all, safe and for a small guy he plays bigger then some of our big guys... yes I'm looking at you Ericsson "The friendly giant". Trading White would be a dumb and pointless move imo.

Also keep in mind he has been forced to play with Kindl, Commodore, Lebda... Ian white, Kronwall and Stuart would probably look worse playing with these scrubs

Didnt read the 7 pages of this thread, but I live in MN and they've been all over Parise all year. A lot of people even feel it's more likely than not he signs here (and if that happens, Suter too). I can't see it. Hometown connection is nice and all but this guy was two games away from the Cup. The Wild are stockpiling young talent, but they're still years away. Parise has to commit to a franchise for probably 8 or 10 years in this deal - he needs certainty that things are run well, plus the chance to compete in his prime.

It's going to be a huge test for him,no doubt,but don't think he'll fail. He isn't the aggressive GM,but neither is stupid not to act when he needs to. You can't replace Lidstrom,that's obvious,but all this situation reminds me a bit on Schneider's departure. Did Ken act then?Yes by signing Rafalski so I'm optimistic he'll do the same with Suter

For the same money most players would chose to go to Pittsburgh over Detroit, Pittsburgh is younger and they have Malkin and Crosby, the future doesn't look so good for Detroit.

Why would someone want to sign with the wild under any circumstance?

Curse you, Dominator.

Franzen never played a game in the AHL. He came over from Sweden and stepped right into the line-up. I remember when Holland signed him that Kenny said he would be on the team. If that isn't a guaranteed spot then I don't know what is.

Guys, we have to be realistic here. Kenny has a very hard job to do and it takes alot of patience, knowledge and due dilgence to improve this hockey team. All 29 other teams are trying to improve themselves so Kenny has alot of competition. Here is a roster I think is very realistic for next season. One which I feel Kenny can achieve if things go his way this summer... CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER My Custom Lineup FORWARDS Ilya Kovalchuk ($6.667m) / Evgeni Malkin ($8.700m) / Alex Ovechkin ($9.538m) Rick Nash ($7.800m) / Henrik Sedin ($6.100m) / Daniel Sedin ($6.100m) Steven Stamkos ($7.500m) / Sidney Crosby ($8.700m) / Corey Perry ($5.325m) Zach Parise ($7.000m) / Anze Kopitar ($6.800m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / DEFENSEMEN Shea Weber ($8.000m) / Ryan Suter ($7.000m) Zdeno Chara ($6.917m) / Kris Letang ($3.500m) Erik Karlsson ($6.500m) / Drew Doughty ($7.000m) Keith Yandle ($5.250m) / GOALTENDERS Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) Jonathan Quick ($1.800m) ------ CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter) (these totals are compiled without the bonus cushion) SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $149,605,128; BONUSES: $0 CAP SPACE (23-man roster):- $79,305,128 Come on Kenny, get er done!

GD! I forgot about Ott...would be a nice pickup... Do we have a link to the Red Wings tendering the qualifying offers? Strange that they only qualified Abby....good that they only qualified Quincey...I can see those draft picks coming soon! Hopefully Edmonton or Montreal picks him up! Lottery pick, here we come!

Was just coming on to ask about that as I relied heavily on the stories to know what was going on as an out of state Wings fan. Would LOVE to have that back!!!! PLEASE!!! Love the red theme. Franzen needs to go bye-bye (perhaps osgood in the background)

His skillset is useless to be buried on gthe 4th line dump and chasing - and at 26 its sink or swim time. We cant afford to "groom" him in the AHL for a year or two just to bring him up to ride pine. This guy the the skillset of an NHL players and very well could succeed and put up respectable numbers playing with Pav or Z. At the same time he could get crushed into dust and lose his confidence inside of the first month. Hell be given enough rope to hang himself - and if he doesnt fit, hell be snipped by December. Give the guy a shot, I like what I see. Nyquist-Datsyuk-Franzen Filpula-Zetterberg-Brunner *if we get a Parise or Semin then bump Franzen or Nyquist back to the 3rd line with Helm and Bert.

I am going with my fantasy roster until they are not available anymore: FORWARDS Zach Parise ($8.000m) / Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m) / Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m) Gustav Nyquist ($0.875m) / Valtteri Filppula ($3.000m) / Bobby Ryan ($5.100m) Damien Brunner ($1.000m) / Darren Helm ($2.125m) / Todd Bertuzzi ($2.075m) Danny Cleary ($2.800m) / Justin Abdelkader ($1.250m) / Patrick Eaves ($1.200m) Drew Miller ($0.838m) / Jeremy Welsh ($1.100m) / DEFENSEMEN Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m) / Ryan Suter ($8.000m) Ian White ($2.875m) / Jonathan Ericsson ($3.250m) Brendan Smith ($0.875m) / Justin Schultz ($1.100m) Danny DeKeyser ($0.825m) / GOALTENDERS Jimmy Howard ($2.250m) Al Montoya ($1.000m) ------ SALARY CAP: $70,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,070,833; BONUSES: $37,500 CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $3,229,167 There are always back-up plans....obvious one Semin in for Parise or if Ryan doesn't find his way here in a trade. Parise AND Semin would be nice...but then again, if Ryan isn't traded for, then I will have to put Franzen back in...like I said, this is my roster until they are not available anymore... EDIT: I know Dekeyser is going back to Western this fall, but I don't like Kindl in there, so I put Danny in.

call me crazy but I wouldn't be too disappointed if we let both of them walk. I don't see what Abdelkader brings to this team that is all that important.we'll probably resign Quincey due to already losing Lidstrom and Start.

Just an FYI, Justin becomes a UFA in about 10 mins...I really hope Holland does go hard after him....

Change is scary

I know it's a limited sample size in some cases (Smith & Commodore), but here's what the Wings d-men looked like from a points per game standpoint last season: Smith: 0.5 Lidstrom: 0.49 Kronwall: 0.44 White: 0.42 Stuart: 0.26 Kindl: 0.24 Ericsson: 0.16 Commodore: 0.12 Now I'm not saying that Smith is going to be the next Lidstrom, but 7 points in 14 games and from what I remember watching those games, Smith did not look out of place at all. Oh, and he got those points playing on the 3rd pairing if I remember correctly. And yes, there are higher expectations for Smith & assumed much more potential than Ericsson because Smith=27th pick/Ericsson=291st. I think though that ultimately the debate on Schultz will be solved by him turning down a contract with the Wings because he won't have a guarantee to make the big club his first year. He'll wind up playing big minutes in Toronto or Edmonton & missing the playoffs year after year instead based on current rumors.

I brought this up because people were saying a pairing of Schultz and Smith would be like Weber and Suter in 3 years... Which is ridiculous.. Last year Ericsson was more poised with the puck than Stuart and Kronwall and Ericsson has taken strides forward each year... If You people are expecting Smith to step in and play better than ericsson then you're ******* high. Ericsson is by far our most undervalued player on this team...