krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted March 8, 2017 38 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said: If we dont trade up to get Patrick, we fail. We need 4 straight draft picks that hit the big club immediately If we get a top 4 pick, you want to trade up to get Patrick? That would cost a major asset, all for a guy that isn't even the undisputed number one in the draft... I'd personally rather keep our asset and the pick and hope to get Vilardi or Tippett. 1 Dabura reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kliq 3,755 Report post Posted March 8, 2017 1 hour ago, LeftWinger said: Ya, and if that's the case, I'd rather keep the pick and draft one of the guys I mentioned. But they wouldn't be moving up, they'd have our pick and theirs. So they have 2 in the top 10, including 1 in the top 5. But they'd still probably want one of those players in return. Oh sorry, I didn't see you put their 2nd pick. I thought we were swapping 1st round picks. Interesting....maybe?? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted March 9, 2017 On 3/7/2017 at 8:06 PM, krsmith17 said: If we get a top 4 pick, you want to trade up to get Patrick? That would cost a major asset, all for a guy that isn't even the undisputed number one in the draft... I'd personally rather keep our asset and the pick and hope to get Vilardi or Tippett. Or we could try to trade the pick and asset (plus an additional asset/pick, probably) for a top-pairing defenseman. But the market price for that player is seemingly set at Hall/Weber/Subban/Duchene/Landeskog, so...that's probably not happening. Which is fine. I'd be thrilled with any of Patrick, Hischier, Vilardi, Tippett. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krsmith17 7,191 Report post Posted March 9, 2017 1 hour ago, Dabura said: Or we could try to trade the pick and asset (plus an additional asset/pick, probably) for a top-pairing defenseman. But the market price for that player is seemingly set at Hall/Weber/Subban/Duchene/Landeskog, so...that's probably not happening. Which is fine. I'd be thrilled with any of Patrick, Hischier, Vilardi, Tippett. I'd love to trade the pick for a legit top pair (number one) defenseman, and depending where we're picking, it might not cost a whole lot more than the pick and a roster player(s) (Nyquist / Tatar / Ouellet / Jensen). If we land the number one overall pick, a lot of teams would be willing to pay a premium. That's why I think any such trade would have to happen after the draft lottery. I don't think any of the elite type guys you mentioned would have to be involved if it were a top 3 pick. If we do keep the pick though, I want any one of the big, right shooting forwards (Patrick, Vilardi or Tippet). I'm not a fan of taking Hischier, because although supremely skilled, he's just too similar to every other player we have. Small, left shooting, playmaker... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted March 9, 2017 I don't want anyone over 25 years old and I'm not sure anyone who might be available is worth a top 5 pick.Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk 2 krsmith17 and PavelValerievichDatsyuk reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadgerBob 297 Report post Posted March 9, 2017 On 3/7/2017 at 6:16 PM, Jonas Mahonas said: If we dont trade up to get Patrick, we fail. We need 4 straight draft picks that hit the big club immediately. ________ - ________ - Mantha ________- Larkin - Svechnikov ________ - Athanasiou - ________ Glendening - Helm - Abdelkader ________ - ________ Jensen - DeKeyser Russo - Ouellet Sproul Those are the holes we need to fill. Could definitely throw Ber2zzi in one of those 3rd line spots. GSmith could fill the other one in a few years. So you technically only need 3 spots. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted March 9, 2017 FWIW... I just ran the NHL Lottery Simulator 50 times. Here are the results: 5 krsmith17, F.Michael, kliq and 2 others reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 26 minutes ago, Dabura said: FWIW... I just ran the NHL Lottery Simulator 50 times. Here are the results: Yes, I like it, BUT did you put in the Uncle Gary factor in your simulations? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Datsyukian-Deke 722 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 4 hours ago, LeftWinger said: Yes, I like it, BUT did you put in the Uncle Gary factor in your simulations? If there really was a "conspiracy", Uncle Gary would be smart to give Detroit the top pick and keep the franchise relevant. The league can't afford the wings being the "dead wings" again and losing the huge fan base we have amassed over the past 25 years. 2 Dabura and kickazz reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kickazz 5,459 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Datsyukian-Deke said: If there really was a "conspiracy", Uncle Gary would be smart to give Detroit the top pick and keep the franchise relevant. The league can't afford the wings being the "dead wings" again and losing the huge fan base we have amassed over the past 25 years. "Victims" don't realize just how important they are to the "suspects". Edited March 10, 2017 by kickazz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 23 hours ago, krsmith17 said: I'd love to trade the pick for a legit top pair (number one) defenseman, and depending where we're picking, it might not cost a whole lot more than the pick and a roster player(s) (Nyquist / Tatar / Ouellet / Jensen). If we land the number one overall pick, a lot of teams would be willing to pay a premium. That's why I think any such trade would have to happen after the draft lottery. I don't think any of the elite type guys you mentioned would have to be involved if it were a top 3 pick. If we do keep the pick though, I want any one of the big, right shooting forwards (Patrick, Vilardi or Tippet). I'm not a fan of taking Hischier, because although supremely skilled, he's just too similar to every other player we have. Small, left shooting, playmaker... See, I dunno if a top-three pick holds all that much value this year -- or, at least, as much value as it normally does. I mean, I'm hoping that that's not the case and that we could land, say, Justin Faulk for a top-three pick + Nyquist/Tatar + pick/prospect. But, from what I've heard/inferred, Carolina would want a high-end top-six centerman in return, e.g. Matt Duchene. Because that seems to be the mindset these days. "If I'm moving a young top-pair defenseman, I need to be getting a really, really good player in return. Because I don't want to look like an idiot and put my job security at risk. Because top-pair defensemen are incredibly hard to come by." As for Hischier...he does kind of scream "Prototypical Red Wing," which, true enough, isn't necessarily something we as Wings fans should be salivating over. But I feel like our cupboard is bare enough -- and the Cup is far away enough -- that we shouldn't downgrade someone's perceived desirability just because we already have players like him. Beggars, choosers, all that jazz. And I'm not sure I even agree that we already have a number of players like him. And even if we agree that we already have a number of players like him, I think that's a narrow way of looking at our situation. Like, OK, we could say that Hischier's similar to Nielsen, Nyquist, Tatar, Zetterberg -- i.e. two-thirds of our present top six, basically. If anything, I think that points to a need for a Hischier type or two, if not now then 3-5+ years from now, when Nielsen and Zetterberg will be done and one or both of Nyquist and Tatar have been traded and we are, in theory, back to contender status. Don't get me wrong, I think we need an Owen Tippett in the worst way. But I also think one of the big reasons why we're struggling to generate offense and score is a lack of elite hockey sense and elite playmaking ability. Zetterberg's been our best player, and that's because his hockey sense is off the charts and he's such a good playmaker. The line of Tatar-Zetterberg-Mantha has been so good for us because, between those three, there's high-level hockey sense, playmaking ability, possession prowess. Vanek was a breath of fresh air because he could finish AND he could make plays out of nothing. I worry that if Larkin and Athanasiou aren't playing with exceptional playmakers all through the next few years, they won't reach their full potential (whether as wingers or centermen). Just sayin'. Give me any of Patrick, Hischier, Vilardi, Tippett and I'll call this season a success. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 9 hours ago, Datsyukian-Deke said: If there really was a "conspiracy", Uncle Gary would be smart to give Detroit the top pick and keep the franchise relevant. The league can't afford the wings being the "dead wings" again and losing the huge fan base we have amassed over the past 25 years. If I'm The League, I'm salivating over the prospect of the Wings and Leafs becoming bitter rivals again. Maybe they'd like to, um..."accelerate the process." (*nudge nudge, wink wink*) 1 Datsyukian-Deke reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 (edited) If we're going Offense, I like these is this order: Patrick, Tippet, Vilardi, Mittelstat. If we're going Deffense, I like this order: Hague, Liljegren Honestly though, I saw a February ranking that had Hague around #19. Wouldn't it be grand if we drafted one of those 4 guys early then traded up to get Hague in the later part of round 1? Talk about a perfect scenario! ...of course I've seen some mocks where they have us taking some players that I've never even heard spoken about. Finnish and Swedish players that aren't even on the top 5 radar. I guess these mockers figure they know how Holland operates... Edited March 10, 2017 by LeftWinger 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BringBack19 110 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 I think we should take a center with our first pick. I know Larkin is young, but he has shown nothing to make me think he could be a good center let alone a top line center. AA may develop into a top 6 center but that leaves us needing another. 1 Dominator2005 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadgerBob 297 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 Watched Middlestadt last night during the MN state tournament, he didn't look to impressive. A lot of floating around, not very fast. I'll keep an eye on him the rest of the tournament but he doesn't look like a top 10 pick to me. 1 LeftWinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 3 minutes ago, BadgerBob said: Watched Middlestadt last night during the MN state tournament, he didn't look to impressive. A lot of floating around, not very fast. I'll keep an eye on him the rest of the tournament but he doesn't look like a top 10 pick to me. Thanks for the update! I just hope Holland doesn't try to draft a "project" that he hopes turns into a genius draft steal.....ugh..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amato 3,210 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 49 minutes ago, BadgerBob said: Watched Middlestadt last night during the MN state tournament, he didn't look to impressive. A lot of floating around, not very fast. I'll keep an eye on him the rest of the tournament but he doesn't look like a top 10 pick to me. I haven't watched a full game of his or anything but from what I've read/highlights, that's disappointing.. maybe it's too easy for him? Or is that just the style of play in MN high school hockey? Either way, hope he picks it up the rest of the tourney. Updates would be appreciated Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BadgerBob 297 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 1 minute ago, amato said: I haven't watched a full game of his or anything but from what I've read/highlights, that's disappointing.. maybe it's too easy for him? Or is that just the style of play in MN high school hockey? Either way, hope he picks it up the rest of the tourney. Updates would be appreciated Definitely not the style of play here. IMO Northern teams have always been more physical, but that's seemed to have evened out lately. The game is at 8 CT tonight, I'll keep ya updated. 1 amato reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 Not sure if that is a draft topic or off season changes topic. Nonetheless, I think they're pretty happy with Nielsen. But, you never know... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dominator2005 558 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 Draft best available player and let's hope that Vilardi or Tippet will be available... 1 krsmith17 reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mackel 681 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 I'm really hoping that we draft a very good player, I'd like to see a big, physical, skilled canadian.... a dimension this club does not have. I really hope we don't draft a kid because he is from or played in Michigan. We have a few average to below average players on this team making big coin largely because of a tie to Michigan. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
barabbas16 499 Report post Posted March 10, 2017 51 minutes ago, mackel said: I'm really hoping that we draft a very good player, I'd like to see a big, physical, skilled canadian.... a dimension this club does not have. I really hope we don't draft a kid because he is from or played in Michigan. We have a few average to below average players on this team making big coin largely because of a tie to Michigan. So, where are you from? 1 ChristopherReevesLegs reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChristopherReevesLegs 7,022 Report post Posted March 11, 2017 1 hour ago, mackel said: I'm really hoping that we draft a very good player, I'd like to see a big, physical, skilled canadian.... a dimension this club does not have. I really hope we don't draft a kid because he is from or played in Michigan. We have a few average to below average players on this team making big coin largely because of a tie to Michigan. Perhaps you'd settle for a nice Swedish player? 1 hour ago, barabbas16 said: So, where are you from? My guess is somewhere north of Michigan, perhaps a place that rhymes with scenario Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,963 Report post Posted March 11, 2017 (edited) Well, Windsor Ontario is south of Detroit... Edited March 11, 2017 by LeftWinger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DickieDunn 2,571 Report post Posted March 11, 2017 Well, Windsor Ontario is south of Detroit...Don't tell Journey that. Born and raised in Windsor just doesn't sound as good. Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk Share this post Link to post Share on other sites