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2019 Offseason Rebuild Thread, Pt. 2 - What's the Yzerplan?

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1 hour ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I'm all for wild moves this year. Offer sheet him. f*** it.

Didnt the Leafs offer sheet Mattias Ohlund? They're long overdue.

4 hours ago, Dabura said:

Any appetite for a Kasperi Kapanen trade?

This is funny cuz his name sounds like food.

58 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

gots to have a token black guy tsk tsk

Ummm......Bowey?

Edited by Neomaxizoomdweebie

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If you offersheet someone, is there a minimum on the number of years you have to offer?

Could we, say, offersheet Trouba for one year at 9-11 milion(or whatever number Win cant match) for one year and then sign him the next year to a more reasonable cap hit.  

(I have not checked how many picks that offer would cost us)

Edited by Akakabuto

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5 hours ago, Akakabuto said:

If you offersheet someone, is there a minimum on the number of years you have to offer?

Could we, say, offersheet Trouba for one year at 9-11 milion(or whatever number Win cant match) for one year and then sign him the next year to a more reasonable cap hit.  

(I have not checked how many picks that offer would cost us)

As far as I know there's no minimum requirement for number of years on an offer sheet. For that reason, it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to do what you're suggesting because of the draft pick compensation.

$1,339,575 or below None
Over $1,339,575 to $2,029,59 3rd
Over $2,029,59 to $4,059,322 2nd
Over $4,059,322 to $6,088,980 1st, 3rd
Over $6,088,980 to $8,118,641 1st, 2nd, 3rd
Over $8,118,641 to $10,148,302 (2) 1st, 2nd, 3rd
Over $10,148,302 (4) 1st

If you offer sheet a player at a huge salary, regardless of term, you'd be on the hook for four 1st round draft picks. If the plan is to re-sign him the following season at a lower cap hit, you might as well sign the offer sheet at a lower cap hit, longer term, and only give up a 1st and 3rd or a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at most.

I'm not really for any offer sheets, but definitely not on a player that could be a free agent as early as next year, who is also from Michigan and grew up a Red Wings fan...

I could hear the argument on an offer sheet for a player like Kasperi Kapanen though. The Leafs will be up against the cap once the Matthews contract kicks in, and Marner and Johnsson are re-signed. Maybe offer Kapanen 4-6 years at $4.05M. If he signs, and the Leafs don't match, that would be well worth the 2nd round pick in my opinion.

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5 hours ago, Akakabuto said:

If you offersheet someone, is there a minimum on the number of years you have to offer?

Could we, say, offersheet Trouba for one year at 9-11 milion(or whatever number Win cant match) for one year and then sign him the next year to a more reasonable cap hit.  

(I have not checked how many picks that offer would cost us)

Only in the range of 2 to 4 first round picks + other rounds as well. Or we could just wait a year, since we aren’t a playoff team, and sign him as a UFA...

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17 minutes ago, BringBack19 said:

Only in the range of 2 to 4 first round picks + other rounds as well. Or we could just wait a year, since we aren’t a playoff team, and sign him as a UFA...

IF Trouba is a UFA after next season... He's an RFA after this season, so although maybe unlikely, they could sign him long term this offseason.

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2 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

As far as I know there's no minimum requirement for number of years on an offer sheet. For that reason, it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to do what you're suggesting because of the draft pick compensation.

$1,339,575 or below None
Over $1,339,575 to $2,029,59 3rd
Over $2,029,59 to $4,059,322 2nd
Over $4,059,322 to $6,088,980 1st, 3rd
Over $6,088,980 to $8,118,641 1st, 2nd, 3rd
Over $8,118,641 to $10,148,302 (2) 1st, 2nd, 3rd
Over $10,148,302 (4) 1st

If you offer sheet a player at a huge salary, regardless of term, you'd be on the hook for four 1st round draft picks. If the plan is to re-sign him the following season at a lower cap hit, you might as well sign the offer sheet at a lower cap hit, longer term, and only give up a 1st and 3rd or a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd at most.

I'm not really for any offer sheets, but definitely not on a player that could be a free agent as early as next year, who is also from Michigan and grew up a Red Wings fan...

I could hear the argument on an offer sheet for a player like Kasperi Kapanen though. The Leafs will be up against the cap once the Matthews contract kicks in, and Marner and Johnsson are re-signed. Maybe offer Kapanen 4-6 years at $4.05M. If he signs, and the Leafs don't match, that would be well worth the 2nd round pick in my opinion.

Seeing the compensating picks I agree with you. 

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12 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree with pretty much everything Iyer says in this article except for (again), I think we should utilize the buyout on one of Daley or Ericsson this offseason. The savings this season, as well as the extra roster spot is more than worth the extra year of the contract at less than a mil. I think we should be making room for all three of Hronek, Cholowski and Bowey in the top six, to go along with Green, DeKeyser and Ericsson / Daley.

I agree that Byram and Cozens should be our main targets if they're available at 6.

I agree that we should let Kronwall and Vanek walk.

I agree that we should stay away from any and all free agents.

I agree that we should stay away from offer sheets.

I agree that we should utilize our extra cap space to take on a bad contract to acquire assets.

I even for the most part agree with his 2019-20 lines and pairings... just move Bowey in for Daley.

As much as I am for wheelin and dealin, I can agree with these as well.  Although I'd give Kronner a 1 yr and buyout Ericsson and Daley, but that's neither here nor there because more than likely either of them will be rotating in and out of the 6th spot.

I think Cholowski and Rasmussen both need a full year in GR, but if they have "grown" more by next season, lets give them spots. I'm all for kids playing.

With the recent success of The Isles, I'd entertain the idea of asking Nielsen if he'd waive to try and win a Cup next season with them. Valuable spot. But his contract just may keep him here for the life of it.

3 hours ago, krsmith17 said:

IF Trouba is a UFA after next season... He's an RFA after this season, so although maybe unlikely, they could sign him long term this offseason.

Trouba is an RFA this summer and a UFA after the length of his next contract is over. Seeing his history with The Peg, it'll probably be just 1 year, because I highly doubt they'll give him anything north of $8M, which is probably the range he will be looking for. I say no to offer sheets, they will probably match anything under $6M and I'd hate to give up the compensation for anything above it.

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10 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

I think Cholowski and Rasmussen both need a full year in GR, but if they have "grown" more by next season, lets give them spots. I'm all for kids playing.

I don't get why so many people think Cholowski needs a full season in Grand Rapids. He was our best defenseman for the better part of the 1st few months last season. He hit a brick wall, and really tailed off after the midway point. It happens. With a full summer of rest and training, and knowing what it takes to play in the NHL, I think he could step into the lineup right out of the gate once again, and be better prepared for the grind of a full NHL season.

I agree with Rasmussen, but not necessarily because I don't think he's NHL ready. It's more so because I'd rather see him be a go-to guy and get top line minutes in Grand Rapids, than see him stuck in the bottom six in Detroit.

18 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

With the recent success of The Isles, I'd entertain the idea of asking Nielsen if he'd waive to try and win a Cup next season with them. Valuable spot. But his contract just may keep him here for the life of it.

I'm all for trading Nielsen, but maybe not until Veleno proves he's ready to take over a middle six center position in Detroit. I'd really try to trade him after next season, in the summer of 2020.

21 minutes ago, LeftWinger said:

Trouba is an RFA this summer and a UFA after the length of his next contract is over. Seeing his history with The Peg, it'll probably be just 1 year, because I highly doubt they'll give him anything north of $8M, which is probably the range he will be looking for. I say no to offer sheets, they will probably match anything under $6M and I'd hate to give up the compensation for anything above it.

... which is why I said "IF" Trouba is a UFA after next season...

I agree that we shouldn't offer sheet Trouba.

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1 minute ago, krsmith17 said:

I don't get why so many people think Cholowski needs a full season in Grand Rapids. He was our best defenseman for the better part of the 1st few months last season. He hit a brick wall, and really tailed off after the midway point. It happens. With a full summer of rest and training, and knowing what it takes to play in the NHL, I think he could step into the lineup right out of the gate once again, and be better prepared for the grind of a full NHL season.

I agree with Rasmussen, but not necessarily because I don't think he's NHL ready. It's more so because I'd rather see him be a go-to guy and get top line minutes in Grand Rapids, than see him stuck in the bottom six in Detroit.

I'm all for trading Nielsen, but maybe not until Veleno proves he's ready to take over a middle six center position in Detroit. I'd really try to trade him after next season, in the summer of 2020.

... which is why I said "IF" Trouba is a UFA after next season...

I agree that we shouldn't offer sheet Trouba.

I hate Nielsen's contract, but I do like the depth of:

- Larkin -
- Athansiou -
- Nielsen -
- Glendening -

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6 minutes ago, ChristopherReevesLegs said:

I hate Nielsen's contract, but I do like the depth of:

- Larkin -
- Athansiou -
- Nielsen -
- Glendening -

I'll like Larkin, Zegras/Turcotte/Cozens, Veleno, and Glendening more though.

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Next season the Wings need 3 young D in the lineup.  Use Ericsson as the #7, if Kronwall comes back dump Green or Daley. Pair a vet with a rookie on each pairing.  The D will still be bad, but there should be improvement as the season goes along.  Hronek, Cholowski, and whoever plays best out of the rest of the group.

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So, what changes can we expect now that Yzerman is the Red Wings GM? I don't think he's going to change everything over night, but I do think it's a little more likely that we see *some* changes under Yzerman, that we maybe wouldn't have otherwise seen under Holland...

Is it more likely that we see a buyout on one of Daley or Ericsson?

Is it more likely that we move on from Kronwall and Vanek?

Is it possible we see an actual player for player "hockey trade"?

Is it more likely that we see any or all of Cholowski, Rasmussen, Veleno or Zadina up to start the season? 

Going to be interesting to see how things play out...

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27 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

So, what changes can we expect now that Yzerman is the Red Wings GM? I don't think he's going to change everything over night, but I do think it's a little more likely that we see *some* changes under Yzerman, that we maybe wouldn't have otherwise seen under Holland...

Is it more likely that we see a buyout on one of Daley or Ericsson?

Is it more likely that we move on from Kronwall and Vanek?

Is it possible we see an actual player for player "hockey trade"?

Is it more likely that we see any or all of Cholowski, Rasmussen, Veleno or Zadina up to start the season? 

Going to be interesting to see how things play out...

I really don't want to see any buy-outs until we need to do them. I feel that we could trade Daley to a team like Pittsburgh if we retained 50% and asked for peanuts (ie. a conditional 7th). E I would sit on for the rest of the season, he is a big body, and could garner some interest at the TDL.

I do think we now move on from Kronwall/Vanek, which I'm hoping for!

100% on the hockey trade thing. This is something that Yzerman has shown he is willing to do with moves like the St. Louis for Callahan deal (though his hands were kind of tied) and more recently the Sergechev for Drouin deal.

I hope so! Yzerman doesn't seem to be as reliant on vets as Holland, and this is something I am excited about!

59 minutes ago, GMRwings1983 said:

The first thing Yzerman should do is take out his personal checkbook and wish Justin Abdelkader the best of luck in his future endeavors.  

You really want an Abby cap hit for 8 more years? I'd much rather retain 50%, throw in a pick and trade him to a team like Arizona then buy him out. And even then, I'd wait until we needed the cap space.

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38 minutes ago, kliq said:

I really don't want to see any buy-outs until we need to do them. I feel that we could trade Daley to a team like Pittsburgh if we retained 50% and asked for peanuts (ie. a conditional 7th). E I would sit on for the rest of the season, he is a big body, and could garner some interest at the TDL.

I do think we now move on from Kronwall/Vanek, which I'm hoping for!

100% on the hockey trade thing. This is something that Yzerman has shown he is willing to do with moves like the St. Louis for Callahan deal (though his hands were kind of tied) and more recently the Sergechev for Drouin deal.

I hope so! Yzerman doesn't seem to be as reliant on vets as Holland, and this is something I am excited about!

You really want an Abby cap hit for 8 more years? I'd much rather retain 50%, throw in a pick and trade him to a team like Arizona then buy him out. And even then, I'd wait until we needed the cap space.

Well, I did say personal checkbook.  

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1 hour ago, kliq said:

I really don't want to see any buy-outs until we need to do them. I feel that we could trade Daley to a team like Pittsburgh if we retained 50% and asked for peanuts (ie. a conditional 7th). E I would sit on for the rest of the season, he is a big body, and could garner some interest at the TDL.

I agree, if we can retain 50% and trade Daley, that's obviously the better route. I'm just saying that if a team isn't willing to trade for him, which is a real possibility (he's old and he sucks), I'd buy him out. A buyout on Daley doesn't really effect the cap much at all over the next two seasons...

2019-20 - $1,699,999

2020-21 - $733,333

... and frees up a roster spot this season. Whether Daley is traded or bought out, I don't care. I just think he needs to go...

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7 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree, if we can retain 50% and trade Daley, that's obviously the better route. I'm just saying that if a team isn't willing to trade for him, which is a real possibility (he's old and he sucks), I'd buy him out. A buyout on Daley doesn't really effect the cap much at all over the next two seasons...

2019-20 - $1,699,999

2020-21 - $733,333

... and frees up a roster spot this season. Whether Daley is traded or bought out, I don't care. I just think he needs to go...

Ok, thats not as bad as I thought. I would like to see him go as well.

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21 minutes ago, krsmith17 said:

I agree, if we can retain 50% and trade Daley, that's obviously the better route. I'm just saying that if a team isn't willing to trade for him, which is a real possibility (he's old and he sucks), I'd buy him out. A buyout on Daley doesn't really effect the cap much at all over the next two seasons...

2019-20 - $1,699,999

2020-21 - $733,333

... and frees up a roster spot this season. Whether Daley is traded or bought out, I don't care. I just think he needs to go...

Daley has one year left at 2.2 base salary. Wouldnt it be 2/3 of that (1.5 divided by 2=750k) for the next 2 years?

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57 minutes ago, Jonas Mahonas said:

I laugh at you guys still pretending Luke plays on the 4th line.

This is one big problem that will hopefully be addressed over the next year or so.  You're absolutely right, Luke has been a third liner.  But only because guys like De La Rose and Ehn are on the team.  Getting Svech, Ras, Zadina, and Veleno into those middle six roles should push Luke, Helm, and Abby down the lineup where they belong.  A fourth line of Helm-Glendening-Abby isn't terrible.  A third line with those guys on it is a disaster. 

Since buying out Abby or Nielsen would cause as many problems as it would fix, I'd probably try to trade Helm.  You'd get a taker, especially if you retained a bit of salary.  Then make Nielsen-Glen-Abby your fourth line. 

Edited by kipwinger

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