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Frank, I can not add anything to what kliq said. He and I are both on the same page. I don't have anything against fighting per se, but I'm against fighting just for the sake of it for the reasons kliq already stated. And I'm therefore against guys whose sole purpose is doing exactly that. I watch enough European hockey here (DEL) and don't worry the NHL is still harder and far more enjoyable to watch. Even without staged fights and guys like McGrattan.

I dont like the long term effects of fighting in the NHL. If there was no such thing as concussions/Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy my stance would likely differ. On the topic of staged fights, my biggest issue is I feel that people can only be hit in the head so many times before long term damage begins. So if there is going to be fighting in hockey, at least if it was once in a blue moon, the amount of blows to the head these guys take would be limited. When you have staged fights, they are just getting hit over and over and over again, and I feel that issues down the road are inevitable. After seeing what has happened to guys like Probert, Boogaard, Belak, etc. and seeing proof that these guys (not sure about Belak) had Chronic Traumatic Encephalopathy, I don't want to see other players go down this road or God forbid we ever see a Chris Benoit situation ever happen in the NHL. If this is directed at me, I completely agree that concussions can also come from hits. But to think they dont come from fighting is just plain wrong. Taking hitting out of the game would obviously change the game drastically, even taking out fighting could change the game drastically as I see the argument that this could lead to guys taking cheap shots as there would be no fear of ramifications. But staged fights.....taking them out would change nothing.

You say its their decision, but in some cases these guys have no choice I can tell you with 100% certainty that some of these guys want to just play hockey, but are pressured by coaches/management. You also say they know what they are getting themselves into. Interview guys that are now in their 50's or 60's that fought back in their day all the time that now have concussion issues (just look at all the lawsuits, or at how many guys are now dead). I guarantee you a lot of them will say that if they knew then what they know now, they would not have fought as much. Its like a teenager who drives like an idiot because they think they are indestructible, its not taken seriously until its too late. People need to move forward. With the advances in medicine and concussion research, and the ridiculous athleticism/strength of athletes now a days, fans need to learn to move forward and realize that we have to start looking at the health of these players, and not our own personal entertainment. Bottom line, staged fights and constant blows to the head for no reason need to end. Yes this is a sport, and people do get hurt, but the NHL needs to be smart about this and try to do whats in the best interest of the players.

I'm honestly really excited about Mrazek getting an opportunity to be the starter. I was honestly hoping he would get a chance at some point this season in some ways. That's not to say I hoped Howard got injured, but injuries happen, and if it did, I was hoping they would use it as an opportunity to really give Mrazek more of an opportunity. I also figured that might be likely because Gus isn't always healthy either, so it just seemed like it was a reasonable possibility... And what do you know... But yeah, I'm pretty excited. I think Mrazek is likely to surprise some people, and as I said before, I don't think the quality of goaltending is going to drop severely. Howard's been having a great year, but Mrazek is more than capable of winning games and will no doubt continue to improve the more starts he gets. He's clearly a confident goalie, if anything maybe too confident at times, but ultimately, that'll serve him well. This is a great opportunity for him and for the team to see where he's really at.

Honestly, other than Howard, no Wings player has stats that look All Star quality. Not sure why every team needs to have a rep.

Until the back to back when McCollum plays.Which honestly. I'll be excited for. I enjoy watching our prospects simply because I rarely get to.

A buddy of mine who is turning 21 can't play contact hockey anymore after having way to many concussions and NOT a single one came from fighting. He got them all from getting hit. People saying that concussions in the NHL is straight from fighting is ridiculous and should probably just go watch girls hockey.

OK. I can agree with the idea that 4th liners are, to varying degrees, replaceable players. So let's take a look at what's been this team most used combination on the fourth line: Miller-Gledening-Andersson. On this current team, I think it's very clear that you don't replace Drew Miller or Luke Glendening with an enforcer type player. Detroit is 5th on the PK in the league, and a whole lot of that has to do with Miller and Glendening. They both hit (not a ton, but enough), block shots and make smart defensive plays on a nightly basis. That leaves Andersson, who I fully admit is not an ideal 4th liner. Doesn't hit or block much - his ability to play on the PK is pretty much his only redeeming quality at this point. As I mentioned before, this team uses eight guys on the PP, leaving four to work the PK. In this case, Andersson's value is that he's not going to make guys like Sheahan or Abdelkader work on both the PP and PK. I just don't get the idea of adding a player whose sole contribution to the team is dropping the gloves and "keeping people honest". I named a few guys who are effective in other ways (Dorsett, Prust, Roussel, etc.) who I would take over Andersson without a doubt, but all of them chip in offensively, or also work the PK. There is zero room for a "pure" enforcer type player on this team. It just doesn't fit this team's needs. Not to mention, when this team's fully healthy, it's not using Andersson on the 4th line - it's likely Weiss or Helm. And I just hope you're not advocating using someone like McGrattan or Boll over either of those two.

So if I'm understanding you right, you aren't against fighting because of hating it you are against it because of health concerns? Let me tell you if a player doesn't feel like doing it he shouldn't. Tie Domi, The Grim Ripper are former enforcers who are doing very well if life now. Stu is an attorney But you are right it's an incredible tough job hence why I'm having so much respect for these guys

And he at least looks like an NHL caliber goalie in shootouts.

mrazek will play to his ability, and take howies job. howie then gets traded for other needs. this is what i'd like to see happen.

And I in McCollum.

For the record, I have total faith in Mrazek.

They don't like Kessel because he comes off as a lazy arrogant prick, not because he's American.

Fun for who? As mentioned, they still have to travel and take part in the festivities. The time off would be much better for two aging players that we are going to desperately need down the stretch. I personally can't wait for the day they abolish the ASG anyways. Haven't watched one in years, so from a fan perspective, it isn't fun for me either.

Yep. Most Wings fans here don't like that part of the game because they've never seen their team actually play it.

And you are wondering why we European fans and players are having the reputation of being *******? It's their decision if they know what they are getting themselves into so be it. As a German you should know how much some leagues are sucking - outside of the big 4 - , a rougher playstyle would go a long way off making things at least watchable again. the nhl has never been that boring but they are approaching that territory in rapid fashion: hip checks almost gone, Stevens like hits gone, Kronwalled? almost gone next up fighting? Sounds like an interesting league doesn't it... Basically the SEL just with more skill.. Kliq: I'm just not interested in watching UFC the entertainment in hockey fights is so different << fans are fired up teammates come together, the atmosphere is electric It's like doing bungee jumping the testosterone is at its peak and people who watch it are loving every second

I still want a RH offensive d-man.

Our goalie tandem has the worst groin against average in the league.

Agree with most of what you've said, and I've agreed with this sentiment in the past, but I think Detroit isn't in a situation where they can't even afford to give up a spot to that type of player. We're pretty much devoid of offensive blueliners, so it takes 8 forwards to run this team's PP. Unless you're doubling up on someone, that leaves 4 guys for the PK. Taking a look at the top 10 leaders in fighting majors, it's tough to find someone who could actually fit a need for this team. I see value in Dorsett, Prust, Roussel and Wilson. I'm surprised that Dorsett has chipped in what he has on offense, especially considering his TOI. I don't really like him as a player, but objectively, I'll admit he has some value. Roussel and Prust play some time on the PK, and chip in offensively. Both get more time than your average 4th liner, though. I don't see either guy being in this team's top 9, so I wonder how they'd fare here with less minutes. I'd give both of them a spot over Andersson without hesitation, but that has more to do with their overall game than their willingness to drop the gloves. Wilson... I don't understand how he's being used, to be honest. He actually has potential, and is a whole other type of player. I'm sure when Washington clears up something on the right side, his role on the team is going to change. The other 6 guys (Boll, Tootoo, Crombeen, Martin, McLeod & Borowiecki) I don't see as having much value, for one reason or another. All in all, it'd be nice to have an element to keep other players honest, but I think it's tough to find a guy who can do that and contribute on the 4th line.

And his GA ( = groin against) is just pathetic compared to other goalies.

This is the main reason for me why enforcers don't belong to the game. How can you enjoy a staged fight if you know the storys of Boogard and our very own Probert ? If a fight sparks from the heat of the moment, fine, let them go. But those barenuckle fights are just to dangerous to do them night in and night out. And I don't want players on the ice forced to do them.

Can't we all get a long. Don't forget we already have an enforcer. Our "powerplay" damn that lines so old and tired. Next time Weber smashes Hanks head into the boards for free. Don't forget we'll get ours on the PP. Oh wait if I recall there was no call on that play. Once again we lost that year as well. Fighting DOES have a place in the game. BUT you must be able to contribute elsewhere on the ice as well.

That's because Holland has pussified us for too long. I get the feeling that you grew up playing hockey and lost your roster spot to an enforcer.

Except he is a two way player that uses his size and is an amazing passer who plays hard....but other then that JUST like Franzen LOL.Also the games I was at he was center for the griffins and I go to quite a few.