matemate 34 Report post Posted August 5, 2012 lets face the hard truth. holland wont do a jack s***. we have: bert, dats, flipp, z, mule, cleary, helm, eaves, miller, abby, tootoo, nyqvist, tatar, andersson, emmerton, mursak and sammy.... too many forwards... the best would be: Flippula - Datsyuk - Cleary (Cleary is better then Bert, period.) Franzen - Zetterberg - Samuelsson (Sammy is still decent, and these guys have some chemistry) Eaves - Helm - Miller (fast, gritty line, 30 points each) Bertuzzi - Abdelkalder - Tootoo (Physical line that can play some decent hockey) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GMRwings1983 8,794 Report post Posted August 5, 2012 All you need to know about why we suck, is that you have Dan Cleary on the top line. Hell, it doesn't matter how you slice it, our forward lineup is old on the top 2 lines. And keep in mind, many of these players have a history of injuries, so depth will be a factor. I expect to see Nyquist, Tatar and Mursak a lot this season. 2 F.Michael and pondrocket reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest mjtm77 Report post Posted August 5, 2012 All you need to know about why we suck, is that you have Dan Cleary on the top line. Hell, it doesn't matter how you slice it, our forward lineup is old on the top 2 lines. And keep in mind, many of these players have a history of injuries, so depth will be a factor. I expect to see Nyquist, Tatar and Mursak a lot this season. That scares me 2 pondrocket and AtlantaHotWings reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
St. Michael (the Red Wing) 422 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) Is this a "everyone panic thread" cause we don't know the forward lines yet and its the beginning of August? Also the lines probably will change a lot anyways. Anyone need a valium? Edited August 6, 2012 by St. Michael (the Red Wing) 1 Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Echolalia 2,961 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Actually I like how our forwards look better than last year. It's defense that worries me. 1 Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Carman 387 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Our forwards aren't as bad as they seem. Even assuming Cleary has another bad year and can't crack the top 6. Last year's number's compared to Vancouver's who had the best offense in the Western Confernce, and Chicago second best. Zetterberg(.84)/Datsyuk(.96)/Franzen(.73) Bertuzzi(.54)/Filpulla(.81)/Sammy(.57) Sedin(.93)/Sedin(.99)/Higgins(.61) Burrows(.65)Kesler(.64)/Booth(.48) Sharp(.93)/Toews(.97)/Hossa(.95) Kane(,80)Bolland(.49)/Stalberg(.54) Our top 6 doesn't suck by any standard, sorry. And we have pieces like Nyquist/Brunner that are unknowns and could contribute, and veterans like Cleary who have proven to put up 20 goals in the past. 1 Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheXym 2,606 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) I'm reserving judgement until training camp and the preseason. I like some of the unkown potential we have with the youth, but I also feel that once there is a more solid sense of what the new CBA will bring that Holland will surprise us. Edited August 6, 2012 by TheXym 1 Z Winged Dangler reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Detroit # 1 Fan 2,204 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 I wasn't sold on that Brunner guy when we signed him, but after watching his highlight video the guy has a high end skill. I'd like to see Brunner-Datsyuk-Nyquist (Yepp, give Pavel two quick high skill guys and let him develop them) Filppula-Zetterberg-Franzen (Pretty much the top line, would be deadly. Franzen is better with Zetterberg I feel.) Cleary-Helm-Bertuzzi (Could be a pretty physical line with scoring potential if they stay healthy) Eaves-Abdelkader-Tootoo (Wrecking ball line, decent amount of offensive touch too) Then Miller, Emmerton, Mursak as the spare parts. Actually.. I guess I forgot Samuelsson. Yeah, we have too many forwards 2 Z Winged Dangler and Cloune reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings_fanatic 677 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 I have been watching highlights of the 2007-08 season and it seems like every goal is coming off of Pavs, Hank or Homer's line. They were simply unbelievable and the top line in all of hockey that year. Zetty frickin scored at will it seemed, but that led me to think what has changed the most since then? Babcock has turned Zetty into a playmaker rather than a sniper like he was that year. That year Zetty always got himself open and Pavs always found him. Ever since then Zetty has been almost always separated from Pavs, and has had to become a playmaker instead. IMO we need Babcock to put Pavel and Hank back together have have Hank focus on being that SNIPER because we do not need him to be the playmaker. I think Homer is going to retire, but I think we need a player like him on that line, someone who busts their ass, can deflect pucks, and go in the dirty areas. Cleary is that guy. Sure last year he played with them for a bit and sucked, but he had very bad knees. I would like to see it start the season and keep it together for 10 games to see how it goes. Zetty- Datsyuk- Cleary Sammy- Filpulla- Franzen Brunner-Helm-Nyquist Tootoo- Abs- Bert That actually is a pretty decent looking forward group. And if Babs can get Zetty to get open and shoot the puck like he used to, there is no reason he and Pavs won't score 30 goals each. Fil can center his own line and Franzen can get his 25ish goals, Sammy can get close to 20 goals and Fil 20-25 goals. I think we have jumped on Kenny's case a lot, but the forwards group is amongst the best in the NHL and can be upgraded down the road if need be. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,962 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 It was proven last season that Cleary is no good unless he is on the 3rd line with Helm. He is NOT a top 6 forward! 2 Rick D and pondrocket reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wings_fanatic 677 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 It was not proven at all. He had effed up knees all season. The season before that the guy got like 25 goals!! He is all healed up, so lets give him a fresh start with Hank and Pavs and see how he does. I think Pavs and Hank will make magic this year if Babs can just make it work, and Cleary has the potential to do a good job as the 3rd guy on that line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Salviaman 104 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Cleary is not a top line guy anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Barrie 900 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Actually I like how our forwards look better than last year. It's defense that worries me. I agree, we have more than enough forwards. Also I think people need to stop worrying and being upset all the big named Free Agents signed with small market teams, it's 2 months until opening night! Watch the Tigers while you're waiting for the Wings to start up, they had a 5 run bottom of the 10th today to win 10-8, after being down 8-5. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
amato 3,210 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 i'd like to see something like.... nyquist-datsyuk-mule brunner/sammy-zette-filp brunner/sammy-helm-bert cleary/eaves-abby-toots brunner/sammy i guess depends on how they blend with the lines. i think sammy will probly end up on the 2nd line although i'd like to see it be brunner. if brunner does end up on helms line tho, their combined speed would be awesome. i wouldn't mind if sammy and bert were both in the top 6 tho. then we could have a speed demon line in brunner-helm-nyq.. as far as cleary goes.. i don't think he really fits on the roster too well. unless he comes out hard and bounces back this year but yeah, we have too many forwards no doubt. that's why i think we've been trying to trade. then again it could just be injury depth since the injury bug hasn't been the best to us in recent years. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Seraph 240 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 This board is dry and barren from the lack of news and the anxiety is compressing the nothingness into a black hole. A lines thread in August is kind of silly. There are still a lot of question marks in the air, many of which training camp will sort out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Samuelsson Franzen - Helm - Cleary Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo 1 LeftWinger reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Samuelsson Franzen - Helm - Cleary Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo Or, if that second line is too wimpy, swap Franzen and Samuelsson. Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Franzen Cleary - Helm - Samuelsson Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LeftWinger 4,962 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Samuelsson Franzen - Helm - Cleary Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo I like these lines. Considering that there are still 4 forwards, and we can only keep two of them, which two do you trade? Eaves, Miller, Emmerton or Mursak...I guess I would trade the two that bring me the best draft picks and that is up in the air. Either a team wants youth more or experience...its a tough call. Or, if that second line is too wimpy, swap Franzen and Samuelsson. Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Franzen Cleary - Helm - Samuelsson Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo Nah, Franzen is a 3rd liner. Only put him on the top powerplay. Edited August 6, 2012 by LeftWinger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dobbles 252 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 i am not so much worried about exact lines, but i hope nyquist and brunner get legit shots at top 6 time. i think the biggest problem the wings have had is never knowing what their young guys can offer. its one thing to get them ripe, but its another to only give them limited chances and then move on without ever letting a guy get a true shot. sure, players have to earn their shots, but you cant stick a guy on the 4th line for a week and a half and then send him down because he didnt score 8 goals... the problem i see though is that if we are to give nyquist and/or brunner a top 6 shot, then all of a sudden, the bottom 6 gets really crowded. that means, sammy, cleary, tootoo and bertuzzi are eating up the 4 bottom 6 winger slots. assuming helm and abdelkader are the bottom 2 centers, that leaves miller, eaves, mursak, and emmerton fighting just for the extra slots. i worry that because of that fight for roster spots, nyquist or brunner will get sent down because they have options. then most likely emmerton and/or mursak are the odd guys out. yet a guy like mursak still never really got a shot. when he played last year it was mostly with emmerton and holmstrom and that line wasnt going to succeed regardless of how good or bad jan played. so once again, he is an unknown that will be entirely evaluated on preseason games. i hate that we will most likely move on from the guy without ever really giving him a good look. yet another complication is eaves. if he is healthy for the season then he definitely earns a roster spot and debatably (yes i made that word up) still deserves a bottom 6 position. if he still has problems then obviously that opens up 1 slot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dabura 12,207 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Of the four, Eaves and Miller have the highest trade value, IMO - though Eaves' health is a question mark at this point. Moreover, they deserve playing time, so you could say trading them would be the morally correct thing to do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cusimano_brothers 1,655 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Ah, how I yearn for a return of a healthy Cleary. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
number9 3,297 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Eaves to Calgary for a 5th rounder. Callin it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robb himself 143 Report post Posted August 6, 2012 (edited) I dont mind the look of our Forwards at all...I have a lot of faith in Nyquist and Brunner. Franzen - Datsyuk - Brunner Filppula- Zetterberg - Nyquist Bertuzzi - Helm - Samuelsson Cleary - Abdelkader - Tootoo 13th/14th/15th -Mursak/Emmerton/Miller (someone needs to be traded) Eaves - LTIR I really like that lineup. Edited August 6, 2012 by robb himself 3 Z Winged Dangler, dobbles and FlashyG reacted to this Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
joshy207 156 Report post Posted August 7, 2012 Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Brunner Nyquist - Filppula - Samuelsson Franzen - Helm - Cleary Bertuzzi - Abdelkader - Tootoo Egads, that's a recipe for disaster... Filppula would struggle to get over 50 points on that line... no way Franzen and Helm can play together, total contrast in style. Helm won't get the puck to Franzen nearly enough and Franzen won't work nearly hard enough to keep up with Helm... and Bertuzzi isn't getting paid over $2M to play on the 4th line. I think he'll see most of his minutes with Datsyuk again. Also, I think Abdelkader is more effective on the wing, but he seems to have been anointed 4th line center by Holland and Babcock (for now). Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
number9 3,297 Report post Posted August 7, 2012 Egads, that's a recipe for disaster... Filppula would struggle to get over 50 points on that line... no way Franzen and Helm can play together, total contrast in style. Helm won't get the puck to Franzen nearly enough and Franzen won't work nearly hard enough to keep up with Helm... and Bertuzzi isn't getting paid over $2M to play on the 4th line. I think he'll see most of his minutes with Datsyuk again. Also, I think Abdelkader is more effective on the wing, but he seems to have been anointed 4th line center by Holland and Babcock (for now). Filppula - Datsyuk - Samuelsson Franzen - Zetterberg - Brunner Bertuzzi - Helm - Cleary Tootoo - Abdelkader - Eaves ^ If we stand pat that's what I'd expect at the beginning of the season Share this post Link to post Share on other sites