Jump to content


Photo
* * * - - 4 votes

Why the Red Wings get injured


  • Please log in to reply
72 replies to this topic

#1 kickazz

kickazz

    Rookie

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 150 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 06:57 PM

Because they have no legitimate enforcer. Simply said. Yes, the red wings have very skilled players who have speed. But when teams like Ottawa and Boston are out there out hitting your players 2:1 or 3:1 ratio night after night, (and I don't mean small checks, I mean big massive hits), you cant expect them to last long. Perhaps Ken Holland needs to FINALLY invest in some muscle? I cant think of any out there obviously, and Tootoo wasn't much of a success unfortunately.. but it makes you think. How much longer do the players need to get pushed around till someone gets a head or back injury. O wait.. Zetterberg just had a herniated disk....... Datsyuk got concussion symptoms, oh and so did Franzen... There's a reason the Detroit Red Wings are injury prone folks. It's cuz other teams run around and hit em. If there were enforcers, teams would think twice before laying the hits on star players.

 

That's my 2 cents on the situation. Please share!


Edited by kickazz, 16 December 2013 - 06:58 PM.


#2 dropkickshanahans

dropkickshanahans

    1st Line All-Star

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,563 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:04 PM

*
POPULAR

giphy.gif



#3 Dominator2005

Dominator2005

    Hall-of-Famer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,135 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:15 PM

I don't think that having an enforcer will prevent injuries... but at the same time having a player like Gazdic (young Croatian) on the 4th line would be more than welcome. We need "BALLS" : Ott, Gleason seems to be available... that could be a start... bring back Tootoo... go bigger on the bottom 6, I.E. Matt Martin...

 

Ideal lines:

 

Tatar - Dats - Z

Alf - Franzen - Nyquist

Martin - Helm - Bert

Someone who can really fight - Abdelkader - Tootoo

Weiss; trade him to Buffalo for Ott and filler

 

Kronwall - E

DeKe - Gleason

Smith - McQuaid


"Some guys dream about scoring goals, or making big saves... I swear to God I dream about kicking ass in a hockey fight - no other way to say it than I love to do it, its who I am"... Brian McGrattan

#4 HadThomasVokounOnFortSt

HadThomasVokounOnFortSt

    Hi

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,973 posts
  • Location:Cloudy Town, Minnesota. 762.20 miles from the Joe Louis Arena

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:16 PM

Injuries is part of the game..


hadthomasvokounonfortst.jpg
Follow me on Twitter: @W2G4U

#5 Jedi

Jedi

    Galmar Stone-Fist. Stormcloak. Wings Fan.

  • HoF Booster Mod
  • 9,783 posts
  • Location:Dallas

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:23 PM

If ONLY we had an enforcer to keep that herniated disc of Z's in line...

 

...and to make sure that pesky groin of Weiss' would be held accountable...

 

...or that Howard's knee wouldn't dare tweak itself...

 

For the record.  Detroit (as of yesterday) sat at 10th in the league in terms of Man-Games-Lost-To-Injury, at 110.  The #8 team, Montreal, is at 122 games lost.  Yet, Montreal currently ranks 3rd in fighting majors at 22.  Columbus is 5th in games lost to injury, 130, and 7th in fighting majors at 20.  Tampa Bay is 7th in games lost at 123, and 13th in the league with 17 fighting majors.  Toronto leads the league in fighting majors at 26, yet is only 2 spots back from Detroit with 97 games lost.

 

I just did the math.  The average # of games lost to injury by any team this year is a smidge over 93 games (93.066666667, etc).  Detroit's at 110, which is above average, but not astonishingly so, especially given that Detroit is tied for dead last in the league at 4 fighting majors.

 

As it stands, the statistics don't necessarily agree that having players who are more willing to "enforce" (a.k.a. willing to drop the gloves) translates into less games lost due to injury...


2cwlto0.jpg

 


#6 Richdg

Richdg

    1st Line All-Star

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,596 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:23 PM

many reasons for it. helm for example. His body is too small for the style of hockey he plays. he will always be a guy that is fighting through injuries. yes being on the small side doesn't help vs bigger guys. Having a bunch of over 30 guys don't help either. Players tend to get hurt more and take longer to recover the older they get. having guys with years of injury issues just adds to the problem.



#7 kipwinger

kipwinger

    Hall-of-Famer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,758 posts
  • Location:Mt. Pleasant, MI

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:29 PM

Because they have no legitimate enforcer. Simply said. Yes, the red wings have very skilled players who have speed. But when teams like Ottawa and Boston are out there out hitting your players 2:1 or 3:1 ratio night after night, (and I don't mean small checks, I mean big massive hits), you cant expect them to last long. Perhaps Ken Holland needs to FINALLY invest in some muscle? I cant think of any out there obviously, and Tootoo wasn't much of a success unfortunately.. but it makes you think. How much longer do the players need to get pushed around till someone gets a head or back injury. O wait.. Zetterberg just had a herniated disk....... Datsyuk got concussion symptoms, oh and so did Franzen... There's a reason the Detroit Red Wings are injury prone folks. It's cuz other teams run around and hit em. If there were enforcers, teams would think twice before laying the hits on star players.

 

That's my 2 cents on the situation. Please share!

 

You mean like how Orpik thought twice about hitting skilled winger Loui Eriksson because of all the big, bad, enforcers that Boston has?  Or perhaps how James Neal didn't even consider kneeing Marchand in the head during the same game for the same reason?  And certainly nobody would consider taking liberties with Phil Kessel with Orr and McLaren on the ice for Toronto. 

 

I completely agree with everything you just said.


GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#8 kickazz

kickazz

    Rookie

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 150 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:50 PM

If ONLY we had an enforcer to keep that herniated disc of Z's in line...

 

...and to make sure that pesky groin of Weiss' would be held accountable...

 

...or that Howard's knee wouldn't dare tweak itself...

 

For the record.  Detroit (as of yesterday) sat at 10th in the league in terms of Man-Games-Lost-To-Injury, at 110.  The #8 team, Montreal, is at 122 games lost.  Yet, Montreal currently ranks 3rd in fighting majors at 22.  Columbus is 5th in games lost to injury, 130, and 7th in fighting majors at 20.  Tampa Bay is 7th in games lost at 123, and 13th in the league with 17 fighting majors.  Toronto leads the league in fighting majors at 26, yet is only 2 spots back from Detroit with 97 games lost.

 

I just did the math.  The average # of games lost to injury by any team this year is a smidge over 93 games (93.066666667, etc).  Detroit's at 110, which is above average, but not astonishingly so, especially given that Detroit is tied for dead last in the league at 4 fighting majors.

 

As it stands, the statistics don't necessarily agree that having players who are more willing to "enforce" (a.k.a. willing to drop the gloves) translates into less games lost due to injury...

 

So you go from my claim on hits per game to fighting majors. Cool. Enforcers dont necessarily have to fight they also put aggression towards opponents through hits. And it's a known fact in hockey (if you play, which i feel doubtful seeing your reactions to a basic aspect of hockey; aggression, aka what the sport is KNOWN for) fighting and hits can curve momentum. Hits can send messages to opponents. Hits make people think twice before opponents go after your star players. Hits are a non-verbal way of saying " you hit my guy, i'll hit you and embarrass you." Case and point 

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=pLX3299cVEg

 

Laperriere hit Lidstrom. Downey took revenge. Lappy was a mouse the rest of the series. Wings went on to continue dominating. 



#9 kickazz

kickazz

    Rookie

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 150 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 07:57 PM

 

You mean like how Orpik thought twice about hitting skilled winger Loui Eriksson because of all the big, bad, enforcers that Boston has?  Or perhaps how James Neal didn't even consider kneeing Marchand in the head during the same game for the same reason?  And certainly nobody would consider taking liberties with Phil Kessel with Orr and McLaren on the ice for Toronto. 

 

I completely agree with everything you just said.

What's your point? I merely said wings become less prone to being injured and abused with someone, an enforcer, to protect them. Hitting and fighting is part of the game, something the Red Wings have lacked the past half decade which has cost them at many times. Some hits can cause immediate injuries. However, multiple hits over extended periods of time can also cause injuries. If the wings players weren't constantly laid out on ice, which more often than not, they are, perhaps they would last longer throughout the season. It's wear and tear, and when you are outhit every night, it takes a toll on the team. The hits per game can be reduced with an equal oppression against opponent team that allows you to send a message: "Hey don't hit my guy again cause im coming for you" Unlike Ottawas game recently where Zetterberg got abused atleast 3 -4 times open ice. 


If ONLY we had an enforcer to keep that herniated disc of Z's in line...

 

 

Actually yeah. Herniated Discs can be caused due to prolonged injuries to the spine. Likely, Zetterberg being hit night and day caused wear and tear. Google it, its basic science. 



#10 Son of a Wing

Son of a Wing

    London Lions Captain

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,587 posts
  • Location:London, Ontario

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:03 PM

2 threads about enforcers.  

 

Its official.  Its mid-season for the Red Wings. This happens every......single......year...... lol


"The leader must never close the gap between himself and the group. If he does, he is no longer what he must be. He must walk a tightrope between the consent he must win and the control he must exert."
Vince Lombardi

 

When asked who won, Babcock said, “Well it doesn’t really matter as long as you don’t lose. It’s like going bear hunting, you take a slow guy with you in case the bear is hungry.”


#11 Echolalia

Echolalia

    Legend

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,704 posts
  • Location:fab ferndale

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:09 PM

 
So you go from my claim on hits per game to fighting majors. Cool. Enforcers dont necessarily have to fight they also put aggression towards opponents through hits. And it's a known fact in hockey (if you play, which i feel doubtful seeing your reactions to a basic aspect of hockey; aggression, aka what the sport is KNOWN for) fighting and hits can curve momentum. Hits can send messages to opponents. Hits make people think twice before opponents go after your star players. Hits are a non-verbal way of saying " you hit my guy, i'll hit you and embarrass you." Case and point 
 

 
Laperriere hit Lidstrom. Downey took revenge. Lappy was a mouse the rest of the series. Wings went on to continue dominating. 


....so Downey's presence didn't prevent someone from taking liberties with our star defensman. Hmmm. So then enforcers don't prevent players from getting injured.

Got it!

#12 wings87

wings87

    Wake Up!

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,615 posts
  • Location:Texas

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:10 PM

A lot of our injuries are because we have under sized players playing like big guys. Z is constantly holding off 6'4" defenders so it's not surprising he has back problems.

"He usually shows up when the game is over and tries to be the hero. Puts his cape on and goes and flies out there." ~ Franzen 


#13 Hockeymom1960

Hockeymom1960

    Legend

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,856 posts

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:12 PM

Because they are made out of glass.



#14 cusimano_brothers

cusimano_brothers

    Legend

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,409 posts
  • Location:Niagara Falls, ON

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:33 PM

Because John Wharton left the Club in 2002.


"Mess up tomorrow, don't mess up now".

- Harry James Benson, CBE.


#15 dat's sick

dat's sick

    Fear can hold you prisoner, hope can set you free

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,291 posts
  • Location:Sweden

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:40 PM

Why the wings get injured

 

A. No enforcers on the team

 

B. Playing in the Eastern conference

 

C. injuries



#16 GMRwings1983

GMRwings1983

    The Killer is Me

  • Silver Booster
  • 20,161 posts
  • Location:Jerkwater, USA

Posted 16 December 2013 - 08:52 PM

I want John Scott for Christmas.  


According to my profile, my reputation is excellent. LOL.

#17 Dabura

Dabura

    Cake Eater

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 12,066 posts
  • Location:In an octopus's garden

Posted 16 December 2013 - 09:04 PM

You mean like how Orpik thought twice about hitting skilled winger Loui Eriksson because of all the big, bad, enforcers that Boston has?  Or perhaps how James Neal didn't even consider kneeing Marchand in the head during the same game for the same reason?  And certainly nobody would consider taking liberties with Phil Kessel with Orr and McLaren on the ice for Toronto. 

 

I completely agree with everything you just said.

 

Kip knows what's up.

 

This thread is silly.


Don't Toews me, bro!


#18 kipwinger

kipwinger

    Hall-of-Famer

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,758 posts
  • Location:Mt. Pleasant, MI

Posted 16 December 2013 - 09:15 PM

What's your point? I merely said wings become less prone to being injured and abused with someone, an enforcer, to protect them. Hitting and fighting is part of the game, something the Red Wings have lacked the past half decade which has cost them at many times. Some hits can cause immediate injuries. However, multiple hits over extended periods of time can also cause injuries. If the wings players weren't constantly laid out on ice, which more often than not, they are, perhaps they would last longer throughout the season. It's wear and tear, and when you are outhit every night, it takes a toll on the team. The hits per game can be reduced with an equal oppression against opponent team that allows you to send a message: "Hey don't hit my guy again cause im coming for you" Unlike Ottawas game recently where Zetterberg got abused atleast 3 -4 times open ice. 


 

Actually yeah. Herniated Discs can be caused due to prolonged injuries to the spine. Likely, Zetterberg being hit night and day caused wear and tear. Google it, its basic science. 

 

Now you're changing your tune.  Originally you said it's because Detroit doesn't have any "enforcers".  Now it's that we don't have anyone who hits.  Also, I'd love for you to show how more hitting decreases the likelihood of injury.  Any evidence whatsoever?  Because one could easily argue that you might in fact have MORE injuries if players hit all the time (see: Helm, Darren). 

 

But again, why let accuracy or consistency get in the way of a good rant.  It's obvious that more enforcers...err...hitters...would keep this team healthier. 


Edited by kipwinger, 16 December 2013 - 09:15 PM.

GMRwings:  "Well, in other civilized countries, 16 years old isn't considered underage.  For instance, I believe the age of consent is 16 in Canada.  There's some US states where it's 16 as well.  

 

Get off the high horse.  Not like she was 10."

 

"Some girls are 17 even though they look 25."

 

 


#19 GMRwings1983

GMRwings1983

    The Killer is Me

  • Silver Booster
  • 20,161 posts
  • Location:Jerkwater, USA

Posted 16 December 2013 - 09:37 PM

 

Now you're changing your tune.  Originally you said it's because Detroit doesn't have any "enforcers".  Now it's that we don't have anyone who hits.  Also, I'd love for you to show how more hitting decreases the likelihood of injury.  Any evidence whatsoever?  Because one could easily argue that you might in fact have MORE injuries if players hit all the time (see: Helm, Darren). 

 

But again, why let accuracy or consistency get in the way of a good rant.  It's obvious that more enforcers...err...hitters...would keep this team healthier. 

 

How do you feel about McGrattan?  


According to my profile, my reputation is excellent. LOL.

#20 Crymson

Crymson

    Ninjelephant

  • Gold Booster
  • 11,032 posts
  • Location:Denver, CO, USA

Posted 16 December 2013 - 09:49 PM



Case and point 

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=pLX3299cVEg

 

Laperriere hit Lidstrom. Downey took revenge. Lappy was a mouse the rest of the series. Wings went on to continue dominating. 

 

Not case and not point. That took place in a regular season game, and Laperriere tried to run Downey later on in the game. Downey did not play a single game of the playoff series between the two teams; Laperriere did, and his presence went unnoticed.

 

Your point has even less merit given that the game in question was the last of the season series between the two teams. Detroit won that one 4-0 also, by the way.


Edited by Crymson, 16 December 2013 - 09:51 PM.






Similar Topics Collapse

  Topic Forum Started By Stats Last Post Info

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users