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anthonyn66

Wings re-sign Cleary $1.5 mill + $1mill in game bonuses

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Now speculating isn't reaching? Gimme a break

Where did I say that speculation isn't reaching?

Did you not understand the difference between blind speculation and extrapolation from existing facts?

In fact I didn't think anything I said was controversial & was being generous saying it was speculation in the first place.

Edited by roboturner

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Don't think I've seen this mentioned, but is there any possibility that perhaps this is something that the Ilitch family wanted? They are known to be staunchly loyal to "their boys".

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Let him play his 10 games to receive his bonus, and if he doesn't impress and show he belongs in the top 12 in those 10 games, then scratch him for the rest of the season. Holland stays loyal to his word, Cleary gets the money he left on the table, and a fair chance to prove himself. If it doesn't work out, one of the youngsters plays for the remaining 72 games.

It still pisses me off, but I can deal with the above scenario.

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"Of course I can explain what's wrong with this, I just don't want to! I'll just say it's made up cuz i'm a mod" Well done harold, well done.

Sure it's speculation. But it isn't baseless. It's called extrapolation and its amazing the amount of info you can get by it. You should try it sometime!

Answer me this:

Do you really think he turned down a 3 year deal from Detroit because his heart was in Detroit? Does that make sense to you?

- doesn't make sense to me

Did he turn down multi-year offers from multiple teams (or even 1 team) to come back? Or was it a tryout with one team with no guarantees?

-Indications are it was the latter (I'll admit I'm not positive as its been claimed both ways, still alot of confusion about this)

Do you think this handshake deal has nothing to do with this signing?

-Quotes from Holland strongly indicate it does

Do you really think his agent was just going to forget about said deal?

-Wouldn't be much of an agent if he did. Of course he's going to reach out to the GM about it.

And please tell me what kind of positive leadership the guy is bringing to the table and (if there is any) how that outweighs his on ice performances.

-If they need his locker room presence so bad then they could pay him to sit in the locker room. Pay him a million buck for a few years to be 'President of Team Morale'. No need to sign him to a playing contract.

I don't know. I guess because these are the things I'm upset about....

I mean if I said he got resigned because he and Ken want to bond over their love of pokemon, then sure you would be right that I was just 'making s*** up' to be pissed about.

I really don't think I'm reaching nearly as much as you are suggesting I am. Not even close. In fact I didn't think I was reaching at all on most of those points I made.

Where did I say that speculation isn't reaching?

Did you not understand the difference between blind speculation and extrapolation from existing facts?

In fact I didn't think anything I said was controversial & was being generous saying it was speculation in the first place.

Bolded for your viewing pleasure

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Where did I say that speculation isn't reaching?

Did you not understand the difference between blind speculation and extrapolation from existing facts?

In fact I didn't think anything I said was controversial & was being generous saying it was speculation in the first place.

Still don't understand the difference, do you?

Again, I was bending over backwards here. First he used the word speculating so I used the word speculating to answer him (and even explained that it wasn't mindless; that it comes from other known info. But hey, go ahead & just keep ignoring that!). Then he used reaching, so I used reaching to answer him. Simple as that.

Edited by roboturner

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Still don't understand the difference, do you?

Again, I was bending over backwards here. First he used the word speculating so I used the word speculating to answer him (and even explained that it wasn't mindless; that it comes from other known info. But hey, go ahead & just keep ignoring that!). Then he used reaching, so I used reaching to answer him. Simple as that.

So you ARE speculating, but NOT reaching?

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So let me understand this... $1.5M, $250K signing bonus and $1M after 10 games played.... $2.75M? For Dan Cleary? Talk about a grossly overpaid UFA...Unless this is part of a grand plan, I am infuriated...

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I wish the mods would shut this thread down. Everyday I log on with a sense of renewed optimism, and everyday I see this thread title and that optimism drops back down into the s***ter.

Edited by wings87

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If the Wings don't re-sign Alfie, and Cleary stays on the bench with Glendening and we can field this lineup I'll be happy with the offense. The defense, of course, will still blow.

Z-Dats-Jurco

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist

Tatar-Sheahan-Mantha

Miller-Helm-Abby

That's not a terrible front 12. Especially when you consider the big bodies that you've just brought into the lineup. If it were up to me I'd do the same with Sproul and Marchenko too, but I realize that's asking too much.

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If the Wings don't re-sign Alfie, and Cleary stays on the bench with Glendening and we can field this lineup I'll be happy with the offense. The defense, of course, will still blow.

Z-Dats-Jurco

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist

Tatar-Sheahan-Mantha

Miller-Helm-Abby

That's not a terrible front 12. Especially when you consider the big bodies that you've just brought into the lineup. If it were up to me I'd do the same with Sproul and Marchenko too, but I realize that's asking too much.

I agree with you kip that that is a decent top 12. But:

The thing I reckon is that Mantha definitely won't start in the NHL. Even if he blows people away. It's not the Wings way, and while we haven't had this hyped a prospect in a while, I still don't think they'd just throw him right in there. And they'd keep Jurco in the NHL before having Mantha start the year in Detroit I think.

Then, I think Jurco would drop down back to the kid line, and who knows what happens with the top line. I have a strong feeling Alfie will return, and be put on that top line.

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I agree with you kip that that is a decent top 12. But:

The thing I reckon is that Mantha definitely won't start in the NHL. Even if he blows people away. It's not the Wings way, and while we haven't had this hyped a prospect in a while, I still don't think they'd just throw him right in there. And they'd keep Jurco in the NHL before having Mantha start the year in Detroit I think.

Then, I think Jurco would drop down back to the kid line, and who knows what happens with the top line. I have a strong feeling Alfie will return, and be put on that top line.

I agree. I was speaking in the ideal sense. Of course Alfie will come back. Of course Andersson and/or Glendening will be in the lineup, and of course Cleary will get his bonus. I'm just trying to put a positive spin on things and get away from "Holland sucks". But then I realize that Babs will surely give roster spots to guys who "are everydayers", despite their skill level or whether they address a need and I'm forced to think "Babcock sucks".

I just can't win.

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I agree. I was speaking in the ideal sense. Of course Alfie will come back. Of course Andersson and/or Glendening will be in the lineup, and of course Cleary will get his bonus. I'm just trying to put a positive spin on things and get away from "Holland sucks". But then I realize that Babs will surely give roster spots to guys who "are everydayers", despite their skill level or whether they address a need and I'm forced to think "Babcock sucks".

I just can't win.

Sorry. Guess I didn't realise you were talking about an ideal scenario. I think in 15-16 that's what we will probably see, but I too would be happy if that materialised this year.

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With our current roster and hoping Jurco bumps Cleary, I'd like to see this:

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Mantha

Nyquist - Weiss - Franzen (by default..damn it!)

Jurco - Sheahan - Tatar

Helm - Glendening - Abdelkader

Miller/Andersson

Kronwall - Smith

Dekeyser - Ericsson

Kindl - #KFQ (just because I don't want either of them bringing down the top 4 guys)

Lashoff

I am still worried about the fates of Ferraro and Callahan. Last year is the year they should have been seeing the injury time (because the kids should've started in Detroit in place of Cleary, Bert and Sammy.) Even now, with too many forwards they probably won't get a shot here and will be lost to waivers. Either way, it really insults them and will weigh heavy on whether or not the re-sign now or when they are FA's again, if they make it through waivers this season. They will probably re-sign two year deals and they will still be RFA's when they are up. I just hope we can find someway of using them or getting value for them. I hate losing players for nothing...its like paying overdraft fees at the bank, just give it away!

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With our current roster and hoping Jurco bumps Cleary, I'd like to see this:

Zetterberg - Datsyuk - Mantha

Nyquist - Weiss - Franzen (by default..damn it!)

Jurco - Sheahan - Tatar

Helm - Glendening - Abdelkader

Miller/Andersson

Kronwall - Smith

Dekeyser - Ericsson

Kindl - #KFQ (just because I don't want either of them bringing down the top 4 guys)

Lashoff

I am still worried about the fates of Ferraro and Callahan. Last year is the year they should have been seeing the injury time (because the kids should've started in Detroit in place of Cleary, Bert and Sammy.) Even now, with too many forwards they probably won't get a shot here and will be lost to waivers. Either way, it really insults them and will weigh heavy on whether or not the re-sign now or when they are FA's again, if they make it through waivers this season. They will probably re-sign two year deals and they will still be RFA's when they are up. I just hope we can find someway of using them or getting value for them. I hate losing players for nothing...its like paying overdraft fees at the bank, just give it away!

Sorry to be picky, but that 4th line is just all out of sorts for me.

Abdelkader - Helm - Glendening (is what it should be)

LH winger - LH center (better than Luke) - RH center (whose played a lot of RW)

Otherwise I agree on the lineup, as long as Mantha is immediately worthy of 1st line duties and Alfredsson can't play.

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Didn't see this posted.

Daniel Cleary motivated by Red Wings fans' disapproval of his return

Detroit — Daniel Cleary doesn’t live on social media.

And that might be a good thing.

Since last week, social media have been ablaze with fans dumbfounded by the Red Wings re-signing the forward to a one-year contract worth $1.5 million (with the potential for $1 million in bonuses).

“That’s just the way it is these days,” Cleary said. “There are going to be opinions on everything. You can’t let it affect you, and I don’t.

“People are going to say whatever they want, and especially about pro sports. You can’t let it get to you.”

Cleary doesn’t.

But don’t think for a second it doesn’t add a bit more fuel to Cleary’s offseason workouts as he hopes to rebound from a disappointing season (eight points, four goals, 52 games) cut short by a knee injury.

“You want to prove people wrong,” said Cleary, who is working with Plymouth-based trainer Mike Barwis. “My main objective is get healthy and play the way I know I can. Last year was a tough year.”

Cleary was an unsigned free agent as teams headed to training camp last season. But as camps began, he had an offer from the Panthers and a tryout with the Flyers, who also were pitching a three-year deal worth $8.25 million.

But nothing felt as right.

“I’m a Red Wing, and I wanted to be part of this organization,” Cleary said.

So, Cleary flew to Traverse City and met with general manager Ken Holland and coach Mike Babcock, and agreed to a deal.

And there was a promise by the Red Wings the sides would work something out this summer, too.

“He’s a player the coaches and his teammates like, and wanted him back,” Holland said. “He’s one of the leaders.”

So, Holland is living up to his end of the deal. But he also believes Cleary can rebound and be the versatile, productive player he had been.

“Dan had a tough season,” Holland said. “But he’s working hard, and we’re hopeful he’ll bounce back.”

Cleary was thankful for the opportunity to return — this will be his 10th season with the Red Wings — and an opportunity at a “bounce-back” year, a term Cleary uses often.

He also understands a spot in lineup isn’t a given. He essentially could be the 14th forward on a roster to start the season.

“But that’s always the way it is, there’s always competition,” Cleary said.

“Mike has always been consistent about that, about using who is playing well. Nothing will change.”

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Honestly, while I was upset with the whole "10 games for the bonus" deal, I see it as a positive now. I'd rather Dan play his 10 games and the team not have to feel obligated to play him for 25-30 to get his money. Best case scenario if Dan plays poorly - he gets his 10 games in, then rides the pine.

I still don't like the deal, but I guess I see a silver lining with the number of games he'll play to earn the bonus.

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If the Wings don't re-sign Alfie, and Cleary stays on the bench with Glendening and we can field this lineup I'll be happy with the offense. The defense, of course, will still blow.

Z-Dats-Jurco

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist

Tatar-Sheahan-Mantha

Miller-Helm-Abby

That's not a terrible front 12. Especially when you consider the big bodies that you've just brought into the lineup. If it were up to me I'd do the same with Sproul and Marchenko too, but I realize that's asking too much.

I've been thinking along these same lines (pun). I get that it's top-six-or-the-farm for Mantha in people's eyes, but Tatar-Sheahan-Jurco's basically a sheltered scoring line, a young two-way pivot flanked by two young goal-scoring wingers. In theory (and, admittedly, it's probably a stretch), Mantha - in for Jurco - would keep that basic dynamic. And I've loved the idea of Jurco with Z and D for some time now.

Franzen-Weiss-Nyquist is, I think, pretty much an inevitability. I'm not crazy about it, but if Weiss can be the player he was for the Panthers, or even just somewhere close to that, it should work well. Chemistry might be an issue, but Nyquist seems to be able to excel alongside anyone, especially fellow Swedes. Miller-Helm-Abdelkader is probably my ideal fourth line, but I feel like Callahan in for Miller or for Abdelkader (preferably the former, I guess) would be good for us.

(Cleary sux)

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i would like a 1 million $ bonus for showing up to work for 10 days too

Ha! Well said.

To me, it says Holland knows Cleary is done but feels *just awful* about *cheating* Cleary out of that *big contract* he was *guaranteed* by the Flyers and is now simply trying to give the man money.

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Ha! Well said.

To me, it says Holland knows Cleary is done but feels *just awful* about *cheating* Cleary out of that *big contract* he was *guaranteed* by the Flyers and is now simply trying to give the man money.

Add me to that list :-)

Anyways, Khan talked about that on 105.1 and he stated Cleary never had a contract like that. The Flyers offered only offered him a chance and he basically had to beat out some of their guys in training camp to even earn a roster spot and a contract on that team.

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