Leaderboard

And what if Holland said screw it and went with the kids right from the start, and they struggled? Holland would still be getting bashed. Like it or not, a team will never willingly go into a season with half a dozen kids in the lineup. It's a risk no GM would take, unless it is a rebuilding team who has cleaned house of veteran players. In the end, they all got their chance to play. That's what matters. They have now earned their spots in the lineup. They weren't handed to them. Sure they had to play due to injuries, but if they didn't perform, they wouldn't have stayed. And before this past season, neither of those 3 players earned a spot on the Wings roster. They sure have since though. You could have made a case for Nyquist sure, but he wasn't the kind of player you put on a checking line. And you don't pass up on a guy like Alfie when a kid can still play in the AHL. Cleary was a big contributor in the previous playoff run. No surprise they brought him back. It didn't work out, but hey. When it never, the kids got to play. It's frustrating at times, yes. But that's the way it is. I do think Marchenko has a great shot at earning a spot on the 3rd pairing. Especially if Holland can land an offensive dman via trade.

Babcock is far from being the problem, the guy had been given a mediocre roster at best and yet coached them into the plaoffs 2 season in a row. I think the reception around the league is "very hard but fair" and that's exactly what you want from your coach. A coach isn't someone who can/should let his personal feelings disrupt his ability to ice the best roster he can with the given material. Babcock got a bunch of superstars to play a team first game for him and absolutely crushed the olympics. Guy is by far the best coach in hockey and there is a reason why a guy like Super Mario is only offering a one year coaching contract (2 year payment).. Once Babcock is gone, people will start to realize how fortunate he were with him.

While everyone's moaning and groaning I think the wings kno they have guys like Marchenko, Ouelette, Sproul, Jensen, Pulkinnen, AA, Nosek, Ferraro, Callahan, Mantha, ready to go. That's like the best offseason upgrade you can ask for. Just one could make a huge difference, see: Nyquist.

Yea I read an article that Boyle signed with NY not because he didn't like the other teams that were after him but because he truly wanted to play in NY. Niskanen wanted to play with Orpik in Wash. Robidas said he chose Toronto because he has family in Toronto. Stralman would have signed here but asked for us to add on one more year and Holland said no. So I think it was just odd circumstances that people didn't sign here and not this huge conspiracy that people don't want to play for the Wings or Babcock. But anyway back to Mantha. The longer we keep him in Grand Rapids the better chance he has of stepping into the NHL and being an impact player right away.

This is a link to the puck daddy article for the 2012 nhlpa player poll, unfortunately it does not appear to be on the cbc's website any longer. https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/nhlpa-2012-players-poll-analysis-bad-news-canucks-183449176.html Detroit ranks second as the team players would most like to play for and if my memory is correct Babs was in the top 3 for coaches that players wanted to play for. Everyone is overreacting to us not getting every free agent we want. As marcaractac laid out there's often good reasons people sign elsewhere. Edit: Apparently I don't know how to work the internet sometimes, here's a link to the player poll (Babcock is 4th btw) http://www.playerspoll.ca/

Which sucks considering some of my favorite players were Russians. Attitude or not, they got s*** done!

The bright side is were a top 30 team in the nhl...

The thing about Calgary is that while the team was declining, they had a very shallow prospect pool, so it all just kind of snowballed until they finally decided to embrace a rebuild. Wings don't have that issue. We have a very deep prospect pool, so while having a terrible year and a lottery pick would no doubt give the team a shot at getting a great, young talent (not a guarantee), with the depth in the farm it isn't necessary. The kids just need to get the experience and learn how to win at the NHL level. Just takes time. And once they get there, Holland has plenty of assets to make the moves that need to be made. All tanking a season would do is get a high draft pick that may or may not pan out.

I'm not questioning your status/role on this site. Many of us have been here just as long... That doesn't make our opinion any more or less valid. We're still just one voice. My point was that you can't really be THAT surprised that people take issue/offense to some of the things you say. Especially when you are so confident in your stance despite the fact that it can be quite outlandish to many. Anyways....I think Mantha would benefit most with some minor-league seasoning. Same with AA. Between those two and Pulkkinen we've got a nice diverse trio of forwards to choose from.

You can't be serious.... You take extremely hard-lined stances on the most ridiculous, knee-jerk (doing my best to use polite words) opinions and then get all surprised and defensive when everybody (but Richdg or Degra55) disagrees with you. It's like clockwork around here...

Don't forget about Howard...

I agree with Pulks, and Mantha for the 1st half of the season. But Jurco? Why? He's shown he's ready. Why in the good lords name should we re-sign Alfie and Cleary hypothetically, to bump down Jurco? I've got no problem with Hollands method with kids, but once a guy has shown he's ready for the dance, get him here full time. No more Nyquist situations.

That's fine. That's what I expect. Someone will go down and a kid will step in in. Perfect.

.I agree, but look at the contract Sheahan signed. I don't think it'll break us in the next 2 seasons

I think a lot of the Wings success with prospects has to do with the fact that we let them build up a solid foundation as a professional in the minors. When young players know they don't have to try very hard to make their pro club, they have a tendency to get lazy, and not progress as they should. When they know they have to work their a** off to have a shot at displacing a veteran player at their position, regardless of their youth or potential, it drives them to become better players in the long run. I totally agree that the longer he can legitimately stay in GR, the better he will be when he does finally join the Wings. I wouldn't want to see him make the NHL roster unless he's going to contribute a considerable amount on a top 2 line. The other thing to consider is, while he might fit well with Dats and Hank, would that help or hinder his development? Abdelkader looked good alongside Datsyuk, so I would hate to put Mantha next to him, see Mantha put up 20-30 goals for the next two seasons, and then when Datsyuk retires, Mantha gets exposed.

Yeah, for some of those quizzes, I love it when I type Gretzky's name in, and like 10 boxes get filled in automatically.

lol "top six defense" there are only 6 dmen on any given night, thats like calling someone a top 12 forward. and most nights it is a stretch to even call him "top 6"

Moves will be made when the time is right. It is the right move to let the kids show what they can do first. The team has a nice mix of youth and vets right now as it is, so the team will be fine. When they are on the cusp of being able to make a run, moves will happen. Not much progress seems to have happened when looking at the teams stats, but when you look at the roster, they have come such a long way. The team was able to reload quickly when the cap era began, as the defense was still led by #5. This reload is taking much longer, as the bulk of the defense right now is very young. But they'll get there. I said it many times before, but I'd bet money this season is when we start to see the upswing. That was just bad, unlucky timing. Holland had high hopes of landing one of the UFA's, and by then Stuart was already moved. But them's the breaks

I'm not trying to turn this into a "City" topic but I think that is something that cannot totally been ruled out. We live here, we know better. But what has the national media done? Very superficial headlines, Anthony Bourdain's special about the crumbling city, for someone out of town and they only get headlines about Detroit and they hear "the biggest city ever to declare bankruptcy", Kwame trial, oldest building in the NHL things like that, makes the city look bad. I know there are people rebuilding the city block by block and we have a new mayor and a new arena planned and reasons to be optimistic, but to an outsider considering a move here with his family, he doesn't know how lush the suburbs are that he will be moving his family to, he doesn't know about the great golf course right down the street from his house, he just sees the thing on the news that says Detroit is bankrupt and the Big 3 need bailing out and like it or not, it puts a negative light on the city. Like I said, we live here, we know better. But I recently turned down a promotion that would have put me in Oakland, CA. Because on the news and reality shows they showed a lot of violence and gang warfare there and I said, I don't think so. And this is coming from someone from DETROIT since 1983! Perception is sometimes stronger than reality.

Just because I take hard line stances, doesn't mean I am combative with people...anyhow, I love when people disagree with me, but not when they just go "you're stupid" or "you don't know anything about hockey" anyhow, I've been here for a VERY long time and contribute a TON of stuff, so I am not worried about someone disagreeing with me. If everyone agreed with each other this would be a pretty boring forum. Here is your link on Stralman saying no to Detroit: http://www.letsgowings.com/forums/topic/76519-2014-offseason-league-signings-and-trades/?view=findpost&p=2528074

Gotcha

Y'know, I've been pushing this line of thought lately, but, as with many of the things I post here, I'm not sure I fully believe it. (Yes, I actually just said that.) Like, when we say we won't stand a chance, what do we actually mean? Won't stand a chance against an elite team in a best of seven? OK, sure. But how many elite teams are there in the East? One? True, we haven't done jack in the playoffs in years, but look at who we've faced since '09: a couple really good Sharks teams, a really good Ducks team, a really good Blackhawks team, and a really good Bruins team. True, this current roster might be the shakiest Wings team we've seen in ages, but I like its chances against any Eastern Conference team not named the Bruins or Islanders. We barely made the dance this past season, but it wasn't necessarily because we're just that bad. If we stay relatively healthy, if Weiss contributes, if Howard comes anywhere close to earning his ridiculous contract, if we don't piss away leads, if we don't suck mercilessly at the shootout, if we don't suck mercilessly at home, if Smith keeps his head out of his ass, if Quincey doesn't singlehandedly cost us twelve points in the standings, if our power play isn't totally impotent, if one of the rookie defensemen can give us something we've been lacking on the back end, if Mantha can chip in, if Cleary doesn't return - if any one or two of those things can happen, it'll be huge for us. I want to believe we can do some damage this season. I have to belive it.

I would certainly trade Tatar if he were the centerpiece of a package to acquire Tyler Myers. I understand what kipwinger is eluding too (sorry I don't know how to reply to posts with the quote above it) but I think you could also say the same about Myers - who in only 10 months older than Tatar by the way. If you were to compare Chris Pronger, Zdeno Chara and Jay Bouwmeester's first 4 seasons in the NHL, Myers certainy doesn't look out of place (with MUCH better numbers than Chara). The point is that defenseman - especially "big" defenseman - take much longer to develop than forwards typically do - and when you consider that Myers has struggled the last 3 seasons, look no further than the team he is playing on. It should come as no surprise that his best 2 seasons were the only seasons his team made the playoffs during his career, and his best season (48 points as a Rookie) was also the teams best season (division winners). Pronger did not have 48 points until his 7th NHL season. Chara did not have 48 points until his 9th NHL season. Bouwmeester has never scored that many points. I don't really know who his partners have been throughout the years, but I'm willing to bet that he hasn't had one as complete as Kronwall. I can also tell you that when you look at his defensive game (because I am aware that Pronger and Chara are defensive minded players) isn't much further behind then these players as 24 year olds. He would instantly help our PP with his huge RH shot and our PK by finally having a player who can clear the front of the net. KRONWALL - MYERS ERICSSON - SMITH DEKEYSER - QUINCEY Is a much better top 6 than anything we had last year - don't forget or underestimate that Quincey was a much better player with Dekeyser than he was with Smith. I would do Tatar, Kindl, Oullete, and a 2016 1st in a heartbeat for this player.

they should have just showed tatar partying every episode for 30 mins.

Last year I was very excited about being able to watch the Wings on HBO's 24/7. I was looking forward to seeing who the goofy guys were, the serious guys, etc, etc. I was extremely disappointed to see just how BORING today's Red Wings are. I didn't see any personality from the team...with the exception of a couple. You just don't see things like Yzerman giving his teammate a kiss on the "Kisscam" or Shanny motioning to the lady about hairy armpits while he's in the box, or Ozzie talking about how ripped he is in the pre-game. I enjoyed watching the Maple Leafs on 24/7 much more than the Wings...their guys had personality and it was entertaining. The Red Wings of today are boring, and I have to believe that plays a factor in F/A decision as well.