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Fact: Jacob Trouba is a very good defenseman. Fact: Kevin Shattenkirk is a very good defenseman. Fact: Neither Jacob Trouba nor Kevin Shattenkirk has established himself as a legit top-pairing defenseman. "Yet you feel the Wings should pursue Trouba and not pursue Shattenkirk." I think Trouba and Shattenkirk should both be on the Wings' radar. However, I'm assuming Shattenkirk is going to get something like $6M x 7 years. And that's my problem with him. It's not "Shattenkirk is not a proven top-pairing defenseman." It's "Shattenkirk is not a $6.5M x 7 player." Trouba is 23 years old. His cap hit for next season is $3M. He took a step forward this season, showed that he can handle a big role. Considering how hard it is to succeed as a young NHL defenseman and also considering the fact that he was drafted 9th overall (if we're talking defensemen, anything outside of the top three is basically crapshoot territory), I don't feel he's been a disappointment at all. Maybe he's overrated. Maybe Shattenkirk is overrated. I dunno. Do I consider trading Svechnikov for Trouba? Absolutely. Svechnikov is an unknown at this point in time. Trouba is a legitimate top-three NHL defenseman who, given his age, is probably only going to get better over the next few years. I think it's safe to say Trouba would immediately become our best defenseman and quite possibly our best young roster player, period. (Granted, that's not saying much.) Of course, Svechnikov by himself wouldn't get us Trouba. You mention Orlov. A few of us discussed Orlov a few weeks ago, might've been in this very thread. If memory serves, everyone agreed that Orlov is very good and that he should be on the Wings' radar.

Ok ok, I admit I´m not the best hockey analyst, but.. isn´t he too old for us? Just asking.

Trouba excelled in an expanded role this season. Logged big minutes, played in all situations, played against top talent, drove possession, put up points. He's 23, he's cost-controlled, and he's likely going to improve as a player in the coming years. Is he a proven #1 defenseman at this time? No. Nor is he a 28-year-old bottom-four power play specialist who's probably going to get 400 years x $500 billion from some drunk-ass GM.

5-0 after 40 mins. GET REKT!

Though I hope you'll have the decency to replace the Bull's cap with a laurel wreath.

Nothing in there that we haven't said a million times on the board, but still a good read. Biggest surprise was his suggestion to sign Kevin Klein to play on our first pairing with DD. He's 32, and when the writers main narrative is to get rid of our aging players and go young, not sure why his suggestion is to sign an aging player who is not elite or anything special unless he thinks we can get him for dirt cheap on a 1 year contract (ie. flip him at the deadline). Though I'm not sure how I feel about a guy like him playing over a guy like Sproul, Russo or Hicketts. I admit though, I dont know too much about Klein as I haven't seen him play much since his Nashville days.

So you're more offended by the Klan association than the Nazi one? Even your indignation is biased against Euros. If you think bigotry is limited to maniacal hatred and violence, you are worse than I thought. Prejudice, even without any ill intent, still counts. I'm not sure if you're just trying to garner sympathy, or if you genuinely don't get it. I'm not talking about play style or player type (unless you really believe European/Swedish is a type/style). it is about you forming opinions about players based on their nationality, even in cases where you admit you have never even heard of the player. I don't have a problem with you wanting Tippett over Pettersson. I would too as a matter of fact. I have a problem with your anti-Euro bias and your attempt to hide it behind this bulls*** "finesse" facade.

Bouwmeester was older and on a big contract when they Flames were looking to trade him. Trouba is 23 and on a reasonable deal. Apples and oranges. Trouba is a better defenseman at 23 than anyone the Wings have now, and Cholowski is the only one in the system with a reasonable chance of being better. He's at least as good as older players like Shattenkirk. Even if he never develops much more than he is, it's worth trading Svechnikov, or any other winger the Wings have. It's not just Trouba, either. He's just the one originally mentioned. Detroit NEEDS two top pair defensemen. A young guy like Trouba, Dumba, Brodin, Fowler, or anyone similar would help. Detroit has Tatar, Nyquist, Larkin, Mantha, Svechnikov, Smith, AA, Holmstrom, Ehn, and whoever they take in this year's draft as either established or potential top 6 forwards. Most of them are wings. They have Cholowski as a potential top pair defenseman, and he's probably 2 or 3 years away from the NHL, even without the Wings' overly cautious approach at development. Why the F would you not trade from a position you're pretty well stocked at to get what you need? How much better off would they be now if they had traded Sproul and Pulkkinen for a good young established NHL player 3 years ago? But we can't do THAT because POTENTIAL!!!!!! The one thing Dave Dombrowski did well for the Tigers is not get caught up in love for prospects. You Id the ones you're 95+% sure will come close to their ceiling and trade the rest while they have peak value. Hell, I remember people freaking out when they got Cabrera because they sent Cameron "5 tool future superstar" Maybin and Andrew "You can't trade a big lefty pitcher!" Miller to the Marlins.

My best friend has her own brand of Scotch Ale "Morrigan" and since she's really active promoting her baby, I've been to a lot of beer festivals lately. Have had many different blends and styles. Even a Chai flavoured one... which was a really odd flavour to taste in a beer, at least for me.

You like dem younger boyz huh?

Ah, my bad. I don't think any combination of these players gets it done, though. Which is why I think Trouba, Orlov, et al. are pipe dreams. Ken Holland isn't trading Larkin, he's not trading Mantha, he's (probably) not trading Athanasiou. So, the best we could offer would be, like, Tatar + Saarijarvi. But, hey, maybe that's all it would take. Stranger things have happened.

Last year he played more minutes a game than ever before, 24:57 as game. He was tied with Enstrom as the top PK D at 2:59 a game and was their #2 PP d-man. In 60 games he had 8 goals and 25 assists, so 3 fewer points than Green in 12 fewer games, and 20 more points than any other Detroit defenseman at an age where Detroit still has their defensmene "over ripening" in Grand Rapids. You're saying he wouldn't be a big step up from what we already have? Please, he'd be Detroit's best defenseman by a long way. So yeah, I'd swap Svech or any other forward other than Larkin plus a 2nd or 3rd or a lower level prospect for him without thinking twice, and the only reason I wouldn't move Larkin for him is that he projects to be a center, and that's another hole the team has.

Trouba is young, Shattenkirk is not Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk

I honestly didn't see much from Shattenkirk that would make me want to even pursue him as a FA. The team needs a top pairing D, and Shattenkirk doesn't fill that need. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Malkin is about to cry.

I thought the same thing. Klein is still signed to NY, so it could be he's suggesting a trade for a guy we can flip at the deadline. He's missing Howard in his final lineup, so maybe it's some weird 3 way trade with Calgary-NY? Not enough explanation of the final lineup. Other problems with the article: - He misses some of added list from this past year: Mantha, AA, Sproul, Ott - Sproul's put on the bottom of the depth chart below Hicketts and Russo?

Holy s*** Ottawa is rocking 4-0 within 13 mins of the first

Is this legit? Or a total troll job of Left Winger lol

Small European? It might be worth it just to see leftwinger flip his s---t Sent from my LGLS676 using Tapatalk

How I will be watching Wings games next season.

Counting guys that actually contribute to their teams... Nashville loses: Suter, Weber, Jones, Del Zotto, Klein, and Franson (basically an entire Defensive unit, and a good one at that) Nashville adds: Subban (one top pairing guy) Still amazing Detroit loses: Lidstrom, Rafalski, Stuart (a complete top pairing and a 2nd pairing guy) Detroit adds: Green, Dekeyser (a complete 2nd pairing) Worse than ever Nashville is hella good at developing their young D men. We've been pretty bad.

I hadn't heard about that sauce in years until the new episode of Rick and Morty ranted about it

If the sheet fits... And bigotry doesn't have to be absolute. Liking Lidstrom doesn't mean you're not a bigot for your prejudice against Swedes in general. Bigots aren't noted for their rationality. Unbelievably, your attempt to prove that you aren't biased is so full of implied bigotry that it might as well be one of those hidden-3D-image pictures, where if you squint at it just right you see a bunch of swastikas with thumbs-up emojis. First, "same type of player/team". which we know means "European-style", which we know means soft/weak/gutless/etc. but that you like to hide behind your new code-word, "finesse". Either way it is factually inaccurate. The diversity of nationalities, size, and play style may not be all that everyone wants, but it inarguably exists. It is a hallmark of bigotry to exaggerate the influence of the object of that bigotry. That same point is also evident in your blaming our decline on "finesse". While there isn't sufficient data to make factual assertions, that alone is an indictment of your opinion. That you include that statement in the very same sentence as "first top 10 in forever" shows such ridiculous and willful disregard of the both the success of our strategy, and the well-known cyclical nature of sports, that I defy anyone to read that sentence without imagining a rimshot at the end. And in regards to the whole "finesse" thing, it seems to be widely accepted that the game has been trending toward speed and skill (finesse, one might say), and anecdotal evidence from discussions on hitting, fighting, the disappearance of enforcers, growing sentiment against stay-at-home-defensemen and defensive-specialist-forwards, and a strong movement toward analytics seems to support that conclusion. I'm not even sure you believe your finesse argument. Misusing our players has often been discussed here, and even you have done so; arguing that our grittier and less-skilled players are playing too much, at the expense of our finesse players. Your advocacy for Tippett (whose grittiness is hardly more than a footnote in his scouting report compared to his finesse attributes of skating and shooting) also suggest you are just using the term as a facade. Finally we have the sheer vehemence of your anti-"finesse" rhetoric suggesting an irrational bias. Here saying such a pick would be a waste, previously calling such a pick "non-impact", and the ultimate example of: ...in regards to Pettersson, who you later admitted you had never even heard of. And even though you have since been made aware that every scouting service believes Pettersson has elite potential, you still refuse to believe it. It might have done your argument some good if you had acknowledged his potential, and just said you felt there were better options. Too late for that now though. You can't get better if you don't recognize your faults. I'm doing this for your own good, pal.