Leaderboard

Lmao we don't even have young defensemen to play for us. Literally nobody in the system is being held back because of this signing. This conversation just goes in circles with people bashing Holland for what he may hypothetically do. The rebuild on the fly is happening whether you like it or not. Complaining about a stop gap defensmen that's cheap is such a minuscule problem in the grand scheme of things it's ridiculous this can cause such outrage for so long

Do you honestly believe anything we discuss here is going to impact the organization? If so I really don't know what to say. Fact is WE as fans don't matter, even if players and owners are saying otherwise because in the end even in Detroit the bottom line seems more important than everything. Personally I've accepted reality and gone into a whatever state, to me the real rebuild will start next year, hopefully with Rasmus Dahlien or that that big Russian kid. Looking at it this way is way better than getting worked up over ufa, non trades like last year

People are in MAJOR denial. "He's not doing the rebuild correctly" , "Signing Daley is stupid if we want a top 3 pick", "Signing Daley screws Sproul over" People need to snap back to reality. There is no rebuild, Holland is not looking to tank (any type of variation), he's aiming for playoffs while maintaining picks, and he certainly does not consider the young defensemen to have the ceiling that some of the posters here do. People here act like they know more than pro-scouts, GMs, coaches. Except that most people here are average joes working regular jobs while the people who made it are running the team. Why? Because they are better than any of us at their job, that's way they made it up there and that's why we're down here behind our keyboards, monitors and a 12 oz pepsi bottle thats flat.

Abby never got 50 goals in junior. He played in the USHL (27 goals in 60) & CCHA (15 & 19 goals in 40 ish games). He's never been a big time scorer (unlike Malts!), but has been the same kind of player at every level with only slightly diminishing returns. He always projected as a top 9 forward with top 6 upside and he's met that projection very nicely. If he wasn't overpaid, he'd be much loved, one suspects.

I see a lot of people making this argument. Frankly, I don't think it's much of an argument. Hicketts, 21, could use another year in the AHL. Saarijarvi, 20, is at least two years away. Cholowski, 19, is at least two years away. Hronek, 19, is at least two years away. Sambrook, 19, is at least two years away. Mcllrath, 25, is not a high-end defenseman. Sulak, 23, was a no-risk signing who may or may not have what it takes to play in the NHL. Ouellet and Jensen haven't been hugely impressive; at this point, they're serviceable middle-pairing defensemen, and that's probably all they'll ever be. Russo didn't really impress me in his stint with the Wings; I don't think he fits into our long-term plans. If we're being honest about Sproul, he's not likely to become much more than what he appears to be at this stage, which is a bottom-pairing power play specialist whose natural gifts don't outweigh his shortcomings. At this point, we could lose Sproul and Russo and Ouellet/Jensen for free and replace them with veterans and I honestly wouldn't care all that much. I don't see any of these players as true building blocks. And, to me, that's what this comes down to. Basically, our D group is bad. Daley makes it a little more competent (at least until Green's gone) -- and a slightly deeper, slightly more capable D group is a good thing for everyone. People say we need to develop our youth. Well, the NHL isn't really a development league -- but even if that weren't the case, "development" means more than just having a player on the roster and giving him ice time "because we have no one else to give these minutes to." Daley will be eating some minutes that could otherwise be going to Ouellet or Jensen, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. The benefits of Daley's presence will outweigh it. A top three of Green, Daley, DeKeyser is better than a top three of Green, DeKeyser, Ouellet/Jensen/Ericsson. Having Daley run our first/second power play unit is better than having Kronwall run it. Having someone who can move the puck like Daley is a good thing. I think a lot of people are unfamiliar with Daley and are looking at his age and assuming the worst. But he's actually a perfectly competent top-four defenseman who can 1) play big minutes without getting caved-the-f***-in (see: DeKeyser), 2) outskate all of our defensemen not named Jensen (and possibly even Jensen), and 3) manufacture offense more expertly and reliably than all of our defensemen not named Green. He's our second-best defenseman. He's a solid stopgap for a team that otherwise has exactly one proven high-end NHL defenseman on its organizational depth chart (Green) and is years away from being a contender. Personally, I'm happy to have him on board. I don't think adding him hurts our youth. If anything, I think it'll help our youth.

"The rebuild will start next year" was said last year too. There is no rebuild. He already said he expects AA, Larkin and Mantha to take over the team like Z and Dats did after Steve and Shanahan. Also, if he didn't do a thing July 1, everyone would be just as mad at him.

1. Jensen 2. Ouellet 3. Sproul In that order. Jensen surprised me in a good way. I expected a little more out XO this season. Sproul was a bit underwhelming.

That's the same thing. Call it whatever you want, they are not going to set themselves up for failure whether it is refusing to skate on ice or shooting at their own goalie and losing games or if it's icing a roster that would be inferior to the opposing team and lose. It is tanking. A different style of tanking but tanking nontheless. You basically want them to end up having the top 3 pick. A means to an end. They're not doing what you want them to. You're setting yourself up for a lot of disappointment if you want to continue to be a fan of this team.

There's a difference between tanking, meaning intentionally losing, and going with younger players instead of vets on the back end of their careers. What Holland is doing is stupid.

Without Daley they probably miss the playoffs, have a better shot at a top 3 pick, and a guarantee of not falling too far back even if the lottery goes against them, and it ensures the younger D have more of a chance to play for a team that needs a rebuild. With Daley they might make the playoffs, where they will probably be unceremoniously bounced in 5 games, costing them a shot at a top 3 pick and guaranteeing them a mid round pick which likely won't turn into the type of star they need, and the young D won't have time to develop. And yes, players do develop at the NHL level. There is a point where playing against lesser competition stagnates development and they need to learn how to perform against better players. There's a difference between "we just drafted this kid and we think he'll be good so let's throw him into the deep end and see if he sinks or swims," and "this kid has been in the AHL for a season or two, let's see what he can do."

Or because he doesn't play on the top line with Zetterberg and Nyquist anymore like he did between 2014-2016

I don't think you are comprehending what I'm saying so I'll say it again for the third time. Trevor Daley, can kill penalties, play on the PP, play top 2 minutes. He brings more to the team than Sproul does. And he's more versatile. Having someone who can do all those things generally goes a long way. Secondly, there's 30 whatever teams in the NHL and only one wins the Stanley Cup. But 16 teams get to make the playoffs. The odds of making the playoffs and making a crap ton of money FAR higher. Have you never gambled? You always play your best odds if you want to win your money. Holland is obviously going with the better odds, which believe it or not, is what a smart GM would do. You don't tank for 10 years and hope someday you might have the 1/30 chance of winning the Stanely Cup (MAYBE).

lol this is so juicy

I didnt agree with the move, but he's right. Jimmy is the better goalie right now.

Yes I do think having a defenseman that can kill penalties is better than having one that can't. I do think a defenseman that can play a top 2 role is better than one that can't. That's common sense. Making the playoffs does help the organization. It's called money.

You really think having Daley In the lineup over Sproul moves the needle that much? I completely disagree. I'm also glad you aren't the GM, and wish Kenny weren't any longer either. This team needs a GM that isn't afraid to shake things up, and someone that looks beyond this season. Squeezing into the playoffs again does not help this organization. Unless Holland is able to pull off some magic (he's not), playoffs shouldn't even be a thought with this team.

With where the Wings are I'd rather take the chance that Sproul takes a step forward than sign a soon to be 34 year old to a 3 year deal.

I would take him just because he's a Byronic hero that would make this boring team somewhat watchable this season. Plus, he has a chance to break Howe's record for games played this season.

Well I'm glad you're not the GM then... Being worried about some possible career AHLer or bottom pairing defenseman that MIGHT become a top 4 and risking it for possible playoff contention would be the worst managing strategy. Especially when you're expected to bring revenue through ticket sales and playoff contention not only for the franchise but also for the city of Detroit. The second highlighted sentence, Daley was one of primary penalty killers for the Pittsburgh Penguins. He also quaterbacks the PP and plays top 2/3 defenseman minutes. Sproul isn't a Pker, he can play on the PP and he definitely is not even in the top 2 minutes range. It's apples and oranges. Daley is way more versatile, brings more to the team than Sproul does. If you honestly think Daley doesn't make this team better then you must not know Daley.. He's easily about to be one of our main penalty killers (something we definitely need with the possible Kronwall injury) and that is something Sproul CAN'T bring; like ever. The third higlighted sentence. We're not rebuilding. I think you're in denial bro lol. We're retooling. A team with 8+ long term contracts isn't a team that's rebuilding. They're looking to make playoffs in April 2018.

People are basically questioning management ability to judge their young players. Sproul not making this very weak lineup just shows where he stands within the organization. Personally rather have an established defensmen where we know what we're getting until the prospects are ready to jump into the NHL. Being an absolute train wreck on D will hold the team back and also won't help the Young D learn when they are just handed positions they don't deserve. Wings don't have a problem letting players work through their struggles as they learn if they see potential. Just look at Smith. He was terrible until he hit the prime of his career which is arguably a 20 point defensmen. Says a lot about Sproul

Lamoriello can't hear you. He's got his two Stanley Cup rings plugged into his ears.................and a third up his arse.

Fixed it for you.

Why do you have so much disdain for a player like Kronwall? Guy gave everything he had to this team, and his body is breaking down. I get why you may be upset with Holland for contracts, but why do you want the guy "to rot" you make it sound like he did something wrong and deserves to be punished.

Might be one of your best posts I've seen. Solid points here. 1. People don't know Daley, are looking at his age (forgetting defenseman age is not equivalent to offense players) and judging. 2. Daley is easily our second best defenseman after Green. 3. He can play on all ends of the ice, and can play big minutes, including PK, PP (has a hell of a shot). 4. Great puck moving defenseman 5. He's better than all of our young defenseman 6. Our "young" defenseman aren't that good, nor will they be. Sproul, XO are plugs (sorry guys I know some of ya'll are in denial but they aren't that good). Jensen is the only one with true potential without having major shortcomings on defense (which is the recipe for being an NHL defender). 7. The young defenseman that COULD be good are still 2 years (probably more) away (Saarijarvi, Cholowski, Hronek). Hicketts maybe 1-2 years. And the best point of all. 8. NHL is NOT a development league. If you're not already developed into an NHL ready player, then spend some more time in the minors.

Please don't post in all caps like a kid that just caught his first Pikachu in Pokemon Go. I don't see much use for Daley outside of veteran leadership and helping us possibly squeak into a last place playoff seed for a first round elimination. Maybe they are in the mindset of at least making playoffs again temporarily for the sake of the new arena. I hate to be bitter like this, but it's just how I honestly feel right now. We need to focus on youth and development, see what we have and who will be in the roster long term.