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Ha, right. The players are the ones with the keys to the car. They're in control. Which is precisely why the league has locked them out from the ability to do their jobs twice in seven years, forcing hundreds of the better ones overseas, while the more average players sit on an absolute loss. First, we need to understand that the idea of a 50/50 split is totally arbitrary. There is no logical reason that hockey related revenues have to be "equally" shared between players and owners, except that it's the type of logic that makes sense to 4-year-olds, or people who barely pay attention to hockey. Real-life businesses don't work like that. Companies and management have the power. Say you are an attorney in a law firm and you bill $300 an hour. At the end of a 1900-hour year, you have generated $570,000 for the firm. Your salary is not $570,000. It may be $100,000, or something in that ballpark, but the revenue has to go to cover costs, pay for staff, benefits plans, etc. The attorney looks at that and says "Not fair! I'm only taking home 18% of what I generate for the firm!" But of course it isn't that simple. Attorneys are very replaceable. There are thousands of law school graduates every year, and lateral hires available from other firms and other markets. But NHL-caliber hockey players are much more rare, and the differences between the really good ones and the really average ones are much more noticeable. Moreover, if you staffed most teams with all the same facilities and resources, but ONLY average players, demand for your product would dry up very quickly. The 2005 CBA was a unequivocal win for the owners at that time, which became a net win for the players in the coming years due to the growth of the game and the owners own stupidity. The owners found every way possible to spend additional money beyond the CBA constraints they themselves negotiated to put in place. They circumvented the cap, buried NHL-level salaries in the minors, and paid out huge bonuses to front load deals well beyond the what the CBA appears to allow. And yet, teams like Minnesota, Detroit, Toronto, Pittsburgh, etc. can afford to do this and still operate. Teams like Nashville and Phoenix cannot. The solution to this problem has nothing to do with what percentage of HRR the players take. Increasing the owners' share is just throwing good money after bad. The root cause of the problem is in the lack of revenue sharing to benefit the overall health of the league. That's an owner vs. owner issue, but since all the owners can seem to agree on is taking more money from the players, that's all we ever debate.

I will say you make some valid points, especially on your method of thinking. In my mind, both parties are going to be to blame in this lockout. You say that you don't think the way you do because you support the PA. You support the PA because you think the way you do. I think the same way when it comes to my disdain for both parties and the way they conduct business. It disgusts me, and as much as it disgusts me, I know that I won't be able to change the minds who are firmly on one fence or the other. As I said before, we are going to have to agree to disagree on many of the things we discuss. This isn't a bad thing. We just have two opinions on the way that these negotiations should be run and my thoughts differ from yours. After 20 pages of discussion, this is the way it always will be from the looks of things. With all this being said, let me throw out another thought that has to do with what you mentioned. You are right, I shouldn't expect anyone who likes apples but hates oranges to smash the apples they have. Same goes for the opposite. I mention this because you substitute the NHL for oranges and the NHLPA for apples, and you get the situation we have right here. I cannot expect you or anyone else that matter to change. You have your reasons for being where you are today, just as I do. The likelihood of us meeting in the middle or changing our minds are nill. Even though I hate the owners and the PA for their actions in this, I can't expect people firmly on one side to follow me in my thought process. There is a reason you are where you are at right now. As a hockey fan, I hope this gets situated as quickly as possible. At the same time, my fandom of NHL hockey has taken a hit. This is coming from someone who has followed the Wings since I fell in love with the sport. Both the owners and players are not going to feel my paltry impact on the sport of hockey. $2000 a year on merchandise, tickets, travel, and so on don't make a dent in anything. At the same time, I hope that both sides hear my displeasure. I don't expect you or anyone else to see things the way I do, and its about time I start acting like it. You and others here have done your best to make me see it from your perspective, and that isn't going to happen. I have to just be the guy here to bow out and say, agree to disagree. Don't take it personally, but its just the way that is the best for all of us.

i agree. what leipold did puts a really big stain on the owners image. can't believe that he is on the negotating committee. but my impressions from reading some of these quotes by players is that they act like they have always gotten every penny of their contracts in the past cba, which isn't true. i think it just shows how misinformed some of these players are.

I am not trying to stir up a fight here, but I had to make a point on this last statement you made. Obviously the owners locked out the players, and refused to let them play under the old CBA. That being said, yes the NHL and the PA are both at fault here to varying extents. I believe the owners and Bettman are more at fault, which is partially why I take the players side, lets look at the facts; - Bettman and the owners have been negotiating in bad faith since day 1 (look at the first proposal they made), and they refuse to negotiate unless it is under preconditioned terms. - Fehr and the players have consistently put out proposals with different methods of how to get their revenue share to what the league is asking, and they got shot down without any consideration for what they are proposing. - Bettman and Fehr are both trying to win a PR battle, difference is Bettman is making proposals that look good to fans, so they will back him, but when they players read through it, they realize he never had any intention of doing anything the players asked. - The players are willing to go down to 50/50, it will take about 2 seasons to get there, but they will get there, all they ask is current contracts thatthe OWNERS willingly signed before the lockout be honored (not a lot to ask, considering they were given a contract right before the lockout stating they would be payed X amount) but the owners are refusing that now. I am on the players side, but nothing I mentioned was based on opinion, or bias. Everything I wrote is factual, and if you really want I can post links to back up everything I have written.

The root of the fiscal problems of the league is not "lack of revenue sharing"... that is putting the cart before the horse. The real problem: 1.The NHL needs a diverse geographical viewership in the US to land a big TV deal. 2. The NHL therefore put's expansion teams in warm climates. 3. Areas with warmer clients don't typically have a lot of naturally occurring ice. 4. Areas without naturally occurring ice generally don't give a crap about hockey. _ In summation, the root cause of the financial problems in the NHL is the weather... and you can't fix the weather.

What does that mean? If you're going to lose anyway, why wouldn't you try to preserve a good relationship with the other teams? You don't think the owners know how the vote is going to turn out before they have it. If Illitch found 2 or 3 other folks on his side, and the other 26 owners were all in favor, it doesn't make sense to shoot yourself in the foot going forward to no purpose.

I'd rent a rink and get as many of my teammates as I could together and practice as a group. If there weren't enough to have games, we could practice PP and PK. We could be our own player-coaches. Then at the end of the lockout, we'd be ready to go, even if it was the next year.

So Z kind of went to Sweden? Like a US citizen moving to Mexico is kind of staying at home?

Given that MLB has not lost any games to labor disputes since one can argue that it was the price worth paying.

It really depends on where you're from, I'm from the U.S. so I'd go on Dancing with the Stars! esteef

fehr has a history of striking in times of the league's biggest revenue making season, the playoffs and also at the time in which the owners have already paid most of their expenses. coincdentally the players do not get paid in the playoffs and have already recieved their checks before then. this gives the players pretty much all the leverage in negotations let's not forget also, the former pa head bob goodenow led the players on strike back in 1992 on the eve of the stanley cup finals. i'm pretty sure the owners don't want to go down that road again

Fehr - 1 Bettman - 3 AND the players offered to start the season WITHOUT a CBA; owners said no. The preponderance of fault lies with the owners on this one.

The writing has been on the wall since 1995. Bettman = lockout.

Realistically? Ugly cry. Picture the raging kid from the internet video where he tries to shove the remote control up his ass, only with less penetration. That'll be me. Two middle fingers to this lockout, boys and girls.

Not to mention if Brunner scores 25-30 goals they will need to re-sign him too! They can sign Dekeyser and either trade Kindl or let him go RFA... agreed on the other points, they really cannot let White go after losing Rafalski, Lidstrom and Stuart...not unless the somehow acquire a stud via the fire sale.... Trade Emmy and Mursak....they have Miller and a soon to be returning Eaves...I'd also let Cleary go or trade him at the deadline (his NTC expired last deadline.) There are too many folks waiting to come up and they are running out of options to play in Rapids... (sure wish Holland would have offer a contract to Welsh...Carolina is damn lucky to have him!)

The Wild have 21% of their cap space tied up with Parise and Suter for a very long time. The Wings have 16% of their cap space tied up with their top forward and top D-man (Datysuk and Kronwall) The Wings have 18% of their cap space tied up with their top 2 overall players (Datsyuk and Zetterberg) I'd also refer to the OP's points per dollar section of his article. If the only goal of the off-season was to sign Suter and Parise, then yes we failed on both accounts. However, if one of our goals was also to "spend our money wisely" then we succeeded where the Wild failed. Datsyuk at 6.7 > Parise at 7.5 Zetterberg at 6 > Parise at 7.5 Kronwall at 4.75 > Suter at 7.5 We don't overpay for FA's when we can wait and develop our home grown talent and put them on reasonable contracts. Build through the draft.

Yeah I'm done spending money on the NHL too. The last of my favorite Red Wings, Holmstrom, has retired, so I can spend money and time elsewhere... Bettman has pissed me off so much, that I don't want to financially support the league anymore, and I'm not just saying that. Each year since the 05-06 lockout I've slowly lost interest, and this is the last straw. Despite the reports of record revenues, I think the league has turned into a big joke (bankrupt franchises, head shots, concussions, lack of proper suspensions, an 8th seed winning the Cup). I've almost been looking for a reason to not watch anymore, and this lockout is the reason... Add to that, as a fan of a big market team, I despise the Hard Cap and Floor, and I don't think what they've been talking about in a new deal will address what's actually wrong. Unless they have a Luxury Tax and proper Revenue Sharing there will be another lockout in 6 years. But, I continue to post my opinions because owners and players read forums, twitter, and facebook, so I want them to read what I think.

last night zetterberg took part in his first fight on swiss ice and got an assist in a 5:0 win gainst Kloten. the opposing goalie started the fight without provocation by taking on Brunner

That ruins any chance my Flyers had of being the top team in Scotland, really looking forward to Drew coming to Fife! Probably the closest I'll come to a Red Wings game!!

I'm disappointed in both Cutler and the O-line. With the set of receivers we have now, he couldn't think to audible a dinkpass to Spaeth/Marshall/Jeffery/Bennett? I saw no less than 5 plays where the Packers threw a blitz and the center of the field was OPEN FOR BUSINESS. OH! EXPLOITABLE! a 6 yard pass can be converted into a 20 yard play when GB brings 7. Our defense played well enough for us to win. I said it. The Bears Defense PLAYED WELL ENOUGH FOR US TO HAVE A STERLING CHANCE. Roflgers was on the turf a good number of times, AND Tim Jennings is poised to break the door off this year so far. Also not sure on the legality of a forward pass while on one knee. Marshall dropping a sure touchdown didn't help. Webb doesn't help when he's 6'7" and lets Clay Matthews walk by. Bear hug him and fall on him! you're bigger than he is. Also doesn't help that cutler is shoving him around, even though Webb walked onto the sideline with that big dumb "YUP I F-CKED UP AGAIN" dopey-ass smile on his face. We do get a honey of a schedule though next 3 weeks. Rams, @ cowboys, Jaguars. If we don't go 3-0, we ain't doin s*** this year.