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No. What has turned this franchise into what it is is having sustained long term success in a league designed to prevent it. Implementation of a salary cap without even a luxury tax preventing signing of meaningful free agents, and then overpaying pending ones. Going long periods of time without high end draft picks, and missing on the lower ones that were awarded based on the way the draft is set up (punishing success, rewarding failure). No longer having the best scouting staff and pulling gems out of later rounds. Being incredibly unlucky in drafting defenseman and getting duds (Kindl, Smith), as well as fluke injuries/medical issues regarding defensemen who were actually very good (Vladi, Fischer, Kronwall). This team would not be any better today bringing up any of its past prospects sooner than it did. Blaming this team's current state of affairs on how it has handled its prospects in the past is quite irrelevant IMO. It's like that person you work with who blames all of their problems on whoever the President is. In reality, this has very little to do with their personal issues, but they don't like him, so he's a convenient scapegoat. In summary, this team's issues are multifaceted (as mentioned above). It's handling of prospects has never been one of them that i can recall. But it's easy to blame our downfall on that perception for those that didn't agree with it. It's just human nature I suppose.

Which you know you and I disagree about, which is why I suggested we talk about who his backup is going to be instead, but here we are...

Casual homophobia... you're off to a great start this off-season already

Oh, didn't know positions in baseball are homo....Hmmmmm....

Thanks. Yeah the team has felt a lot more vet dependent than past years; which obviously any wings fan could agree is less exciting. Hopefully they start to get away from that again starting next year.

re-signing Green to a 1 year deal would help in two ways, he was one of our best D-men, plus the trade that hopefully would happen this time at the TDL. TD is tradable as well this TDL, although he can control where he goes. (15 team No-trade list) Add them along with Howard and Nyquist, they could net us a couple extra 2nds and 3rds maybe. Of course with what Holland fleeced Vegas for, who flippin knows what we could acquire. Couple all that with our drafting of Dahlin (or other high end D man in the top 8) and Kronwall retiring, 2019 Camp is shaping up to be a great competition for available spots!

Yeah but hockey is real.

Holland: Y'know we'd really like to put #91 in the rafters. How would you like to have your name on the banner instead of Fedorov? Tavares: Where do I sign, Ken?

Nevermind. I forgot who I was arguing with about Franzen. I may as well ask DraperFan (is he still around?) how he feels about Todd Bertuzzi.

How I see it: Jensen: Cost-effective option, doesn't move the needle either way Kronwall: Enjoy your last season buddy Ouellet: Get Marc Bergevin on the phone before the rest of league catches wind that he's not good Dekeyser & Ericsson: Overpaid in dollars and term Green & Daley: Effective Dmen on fair contracts Hicketts: Time to promote I am, as most know, anti-scorched earth with this rebuild. I would like to see the team use this period of time to critically assess who helps us and who is fat. Keep the later, trim the former. Green & Daley, to me, are what is going right with this defense. I would like to keep both. Dekesyer & Ericsson on the other hand, represent all that is wrong with this defense. Unfortunately we are probably stuck with both. Kronwall, Jensen, & Ouellet I do not feel strongly about one way or the other. However, because we cannot move DD and E, I would like to see Jensen and XO go. I like Jensen's price tag, but this is not a playoff team in need of inexpensive backup players. Trade XO for whatever we can get while he still has value. Give their spots to Hicketts and/or Sulak/Free-Agent.

I disagree with this. There were "past their prime" guys in 02 for sure (Yzerman, Hull, Larionov, Robitaille, Olausson, Duchesne) but there were also "past their prime" guys in 08 as well (Lidstrom, Rafalski, Lilja, Holmstrom, Drake). Plus the entire "Grind Line" of McCarty, Maltby, and Draper were in their prime in 02, but well past their primes in 08. The 02 team also had Fedorov and Shanahan in their primes vs. Datsyuk and Zetterberg in 08. Both teams had "past their prime" Chelios and Hasek, obviously both were better in 02. But the biggest advantage for me is that the 02 team had a much younger Lidstrom. The "past their prime argument" doesn't work for me considering there were 8 guys who played for both teams and were 6 years older in 08.

This is right in Kenny's wheel house!!! 4 years $6Mill per come on Kenny lets see what your made of we didn't just re-up with you for nothing...lets see a glorious NTC thrown in to boot. Manning went to 2 Superbowls and won a Championship after his surgery, not the best of examples.

Regardless of what type of surgery it is, statistically he has a risk of further complications and another surgery. That's inherent of spinal/back surgeries in general. If he was like Zetterberg who was mid contract it would be one thing because we have no choice and hope for the best (so far so good). But for a team like us that's rebuilding. To sign a guy who is a free agent AFTER he had a spinal surgery? That's not really the smartest of decisions. We actually have a choice here. Walk away. We don't need him. If we resign him, do it for cheap. I mean like 2-3 million at most and only for a year. See how he does. God ffs stay away otherwise.

I'm not sure who Ray Koch is, but I found this little tidbit regarding David Pope interesting... "When I watch David Pope play, there’s one particular comparison that comes to mind: Jake Guentzel. I know, I know, it’s way too cliché and way too early to say that. But really, he posted 41 points in 35 games, including 20 goals. He also has 12 power play goals, which ranked first in the nation. He likes to hang in the right slot and uncork one-timers that seem to either go in or nick off the post every time. Watching him play is like poetry in motion. More so, he has all the attributes to be an NHL star. He’s big, fast, physical and smart. And of course, he can really shoot the puck. Like, really shoot the puck. So why No. 2 on the list? Injuries hampered him part of his senior season, and probably cost him the NCHC player of the year, which he was nominated for. Pope may have the potential for the brightest future of all the Maverick student athletes, and I expect to see him in the NHL next year. The Red Wings are impressed with him and said he could compete for a roster spot next season." https://unothegateway.com/top-five-standout-mavletes-year/ There's no way Pope is even remotely close to the level of player as Jake Guentzel, but even if he could be a solid 3rd line winger that can help out offensively, I'd be happy. Another player I'd like to see given an opportunity and potentially a roster spot over a vet... Put your words into action Kenny!

Avs gooning it up when losing. Where have I seen that before?

Holy wall of LeftWinger posts

We're not going to have multiple defensive prospects in the press box. If they're not in the top 6, they will be in the minors where they should be. Better to have Lashoff/Russo/Sulak in those 7/8 spots. If we carry 8. Which we won't.

Fun fact: The 08 team (Avg. age 32.1 yrs) was older than the 02 team (31.9), though the top forwards were younger. Many of the names in 02 were past their prime, true, but most of the 08 forwards weren't anything special even in their prime. I'd take over-the-hill Yzerman, Hull, and Robitaille over prime (really not quite even in their prime yet) Franzen, Filppula, and Hudler. I'd also take the prime grind line from 02 over the older mess of a 4th line we had in 08. Homer, Cleary, Sammy, Helm in 08 maybe a little better than 02 Homer, Larionov, rookie Datsyuk, and Devereaux. Datsyuk and Zetterberg over Fedorov and Shanahan. Overall forwards are pretty even. If we're thinking Avs-series-Franzen, I'd give the edge to 08. Normal-Franzen then I'd go 02. 08 gets an edge on defense, 02 in goal. 02 in coaching, 08 in system. A hypothetical 7 game series could very well come down to which team did a better job keeping Lidstrom out against the other top line. 02 team would have home ice, Bowman, and a younger Nick. Winner.

Most of those Hall of Famers were much past their prime. Most of the best players of the 08 team was young. They would have beaten the 02 guys at their age in 2002. The Nashville and Dallas struggles you mentioned are nothing compared to the 02 struggle Avs gave the Wings. The Wings in 2008 were just better than most teams in every way. They literally had puck possession most of the game in every game. 08 team is underrated around here because we get spoiled by names like Hull, Robataille, Yzerman. Guys who were pretty far past their prime in 02. Yep. Sure can.

At this point, I don't care who wins the Cup, just someone please knock off the Penguins!

The only thing that ever made me watch the WWE.