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There have definitely been stretches where Franzen hasn't been giving all of his effort. Not gonna stick up for him for that ever. The thing is, even when he is working his ass off but not scoring, he is still accused of floating. He has become that much of a whipping boy that not scoring automatically means he is not trying. I saw a hard working Franzen in the playoffs. He wasn't driving the net as much as he should have, but he was still skating. If he works, I have no issue with him being here. Because even if he isn't scoring, he is responsible in his own end. It is just a matter of having enough scoring depth that the team doesn't absolutely depend on him going into beast mode to win. If the team has that depth, his contract does not hinder the team one bit. Also, his dry spell this season was not nearly as bad as it was the season before last. IF he can avoid a head injury this coming season, I have no doubt he can be a very effective player for the team. It is just a matter of managing expectations of him. Even when Datsyuk came back from a concussion, he was hesitant to get into the dirty areas for a nice while. As someone who has had my bell rung when I was a teen, I can't really fault someone for not getting too involved with the rough stuff. Especially in a professional sport at that level. I still think next season when he is good and healthy again, the coaching staff should park him in front of the net on the PP.

I think bottom line gritty players are a little overrated for this team. Helm, Glendening, Miller, Abby, Callahan are all gritty enough. We need gritty top 6 forwards to absorb some of the punishment that Z and Dats take. A guy like Evander Kane or Wayne Simmonds would go a long way in terms of taking the load off of Z and Dats. Also you have to consider that Nyquist and Tatar are small guys that will take punishment too. I'd be okay with an overpayment for Kane or Simmonds because it will pay off big time for our team in the long run because we don't have any top 6 gritty players. Corey Perry is a pretty perfect example of what this team needs but he is nowhere near available.

But this is nothing new for Franzen. I've been holding out hope for several seasons now, making excuses for him and defending him, and ever year its lather, rinse, repeat. Is it a concussion or anxiety/mental illness or laziness, I really don't know. But watching him out on the ice, he looks like he's just out of gas. He looks so tired and lethargic, the way he skates, the way he shoots the puck, the way he hits. There just seems to be no energy behind anything he does. What frustrates me the most is when he gets knocked down or falls down. While other players pop back up in an instant, it takes Franzen forever to get back to his feet, and even longer to get back into the play. I find myself screaming at the TV. I don't think that it's criticism for when he's not scoring goals. No one gives Helm s*** when he doesn't score. Because he's noticeable and is involved in the play and plays hard every shift. Datsyuk and Zetterberg seem to have pointless or goalless streaks every year, but no one ever accuses them of being lazy or uninterested. I agree 100% with what Babcock said about how Franzen handles the media. Okay, we get it, you're shy and what not, but so is Datsyuk, so was Brad Stuart. But you don't have to say idiotic things when you do talk. Take some responsibility, act like you care, show an ounce of passion or something. Stop with the "I'm not a goal scorer crap". His attitude off the ice seems to reflect his play on the ice. Fans would be much more apt to give Franzen the benefit of the doubt if he at least acted like he cared.

Officially on the Kings bandwagon.

Why would we have better off with Hossa? Is it because of your blinded man love for him or brutal hatred for Franzen? In the 5 seasons since Hossa went to Chicago he has scored 125 goals in 315 games , .39 goals/ game average @ 5.275 million a year. In the same amount of time Franzen has 97 goals in 275 games, .35 goals per game average @ 3.9 million per year. 1.8 million per year difference for .04 more goals per game. If I'm doing the math correctly it seems that on cold hard facts alone we are actually getting a bargain with the Mule over Hossa. With that being said I hope we can trade Franzen, I still think the Canucks are a good trade partner for us. They can stick Franzen with the Sedin sisters and I would be glad to see some kind of deal that involved Kesler coming back this way.

Now that you mentioned it I should have picked different lottery numbers last week. It made sense at the time hudler and Franzen had very good years.

Babs is the best coach in the NHL period. If someone has to be replaced, it should be Kenny.

Horn would be good. But Holland seems to like to overpay Nash........... But and this is important, he is also like Hommer in the fact he is limited other than in front of the net. My personnel preferences are Martin and Hanzel. Nice AHL player but he isn't even as good as Glendening. About the same size as well-a little small.

Merde.

Here is Game 7 of the playoff series with Colorado http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4hL4nUq3Y4 Game 5 of the Finals http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WqRHDppnxCs

Holy crap what a game. Ducks are a scary good team. Go Kings and thank you Gaborik! Nice deadline pickup by the Kings.

I want the Kings to advance. Because I like them, but more because I think they'd be the tougher matchup for the Blackhawks, who must. not. repeat.

This is pretty much exactly what I got taken apart for saying in the other thread, but with slightly more positivity. No point paying a guy 20m to go away when he can still contribute to some degree and we have no one ready to replace him yet. . His cap hit is representative of the player he is, and to date has been pretty good value. Franzen in beast mode all the time would be a 6-7m player, no problem. Ah yes....factual information! How dare some one use statistical analysis to counter gut feeling, emotional reactions and fan logic of visible effort = more contribution. People have even wanted Tootoo ahead of him because he hits and fights....and does almost nothing else. Sure, a skilled guy who works his ass off is better than one that doesn't, but a skilled guy with variable effort levels is often better than a no-skill guy that tries as hard as he can...... Despite my earlier comment, I really wanted Tootoo to succeed here, but ultimately he's not good enough for a team aspiring to play any sort of possession game, either skill wise or tactically. His signing made a lot of sense, but it didn't work for either party, and if his time in Grand Rapids shows us anything, he really needs a change of scenery asap.

You're forgetting to include Weiss a guy that costs about 5 mil a year and has 4 years left on his contract. I really don't want Legwand back, if he was an actual asset he would have been playing top 6 minutes in the playoffs and not rotting on the wing on line 3. He might not be the perfect answer, as he does tend to float, but the guy knows how to hit the back of the net. My biggest frustration with the Wings offensively is that they have no aim, which leads to unfinished scoring chances. I don't think I've even seen a team miss the net as much as the current team does. On a side note I think Moulson would be the better choice.

Weiss, Tootoo, and Sammy PLUS a truckload of plastic rats. That should get it done.

would love hanzal

For those who want Franzen gone, Vanek is not the answer.

Its all speculation on my end but I think it comes down to his run and gun style of play. Tootoo is about opportunistic hits, and that typically presents itself in the corners in the offensive zone. Tootoo goes for the big hit, and potentially takes himself out of the play (even if for a moment). The crowd is cheering cuz Toots is loose, but Babcock only sees the opposition breaking out of their zone, and Tootoo is behind the play. It's a 4 on 4, or 4 on 3 coming into our zone. I don't know what Babcock's role for Tootoo was, but I can only imagine that it involved playing with defense in mind. The players who typically persist on Babcock's fourth line (or anywhere in the lineup, really) are the ones who battle well along the boards and eat up time, but don't get lost on the play or caught deep when the puck is coming back into our zone. When they lose possession they back off and clog the neutral zone and backcheck hard, they don't go for the big hit when it takes them out of the play, and doesn't prevent the breakout either.I don't know the exact reason why Tootoo couldn't maintain a spot in the lineup but I suspect it has to do with the above.

Franzen was the only player on the team I saw put Lucic on his backside, he led all forwards in blocked shots, he had twice as many takeaways than giveaways and set up all kinds of scoring chances that didn't get buried. There was bad too, he took a lot of bad shots, the turnover's he had ended up in our net and he couldn't bury any of the chances he had, but he wasn't close to the worst forward for the Wings during that series.

I honestly doubt that Calle would have cracked our lineup. We have a S-ton of centers. The way I see it Sheahan > Jarnkrok

Pretty sure our PP problems have a lot more to do with the retirements of one Lidstrom, Rafalski, and Holmstrom than McLellan. I find it hard to believe that Todd McLellan is simply that much smarter at organizing a PP system than Renney.

We know where he goes... He has a pillow fort in the dressing room.... I imagine it to be a lot like this:

They already have...

hopefully we sign malykhin to replace calle

Have you met (read) me? When am I *not* drunk off my ass? And I like some of you assholes...